Debt Collection Notice but no initial Penalty Notice - Indigo and ZZPS

J1234ST

Hello all,

Firstly, thank you for everyone who has posted informative threads and responded to some of the parking issues people have faced. Having read the NEWBIES FAQ thread, and from there researched several other threads and sources further, I believe my case to be a bit different and would therefore really appreciate any advice you're able to give.

Yesterday (28th March 2019) I received a Debt Collection Notice for £170 in relation to an unpaid parking penalty notice from ZZPS. HOWEVER, I never received an initial penalty notice.

This parking penalty notice refers back to 10th February 2019, when the ticket machines at St Albans Station Way MSCP Car Park (managed by Indigo Park Solutions UK Limited) were not working (on all floors at all locations within the car park), and as such I wasn't able to purchase a valid ticket. Myself and a number of other users of the car park went into the station to ask what to do, where we were told by thameslink staff to put a note in the window of the vehicle explaining this and were informed as such that it wouldn't be a problem.

Obviously this wasn't correct, and I've now received the Debt Collection Notice, however I'm not sure what to do as I've missed the 28 day appeal window with the Indigo Park Solutions. I am unable to log into the Indigo online portal to appeal the penalty notice as an error message states "Please contact the company whose details will appear on the correspondence that has been sent to you.". I just rang Indigo to say that I never received the initial Penalty Notice (accepting no responsibility for the vehicle other than being it's owner, etc, and also recording the call so I can accurately transcribe below their advice) to which they said:

"Notices for that location since November have been dealt with by ZZPS, we don't actually deal with any of the notice administration for that, so with regards to the letter you didn't receive, it would be them that send them out, so you need to contact them. Govia Thameslink have outsourced all notice administration to that company, so in regards to notice queries you need to go through them [ZZPS] to deal with that... in order to have the opportunity to appeal. Speak to them and explain to them that you have received the final letter asking for the higher amount but you never received your initial letter for the notice and you want the chance to appeal. You can state also that you have spoken to us and that is what I have advised you to do".

I'm hesitant to contact ZZPS given that the forums all state not to contact the debt collector, however with Indigo advising me that this is my only route to appeal I feel like my hands are tied a bit! What would you recommended I do?

It's also worth noting that I have contacted Thameslink online to explain the situation and inform them that their staff incorrectly told myself and a number of other people not to worry about purchasing a ticket as all of the machines were down, and asking if there is anything they are able to do about it.

Again, any advice you can offer will be much appreciated.

twhitehousescat

there is no appeal , this is a railway car park and NOT a parking ticket (as such) read newbies thread on BYLAWS

"Notices for that location since November have been dealt with by ZZPS, we don't actually deal with any of the notice administration for that, so with regards to the letter you didn't receive, it would be them that send them out, so you need to contact them. Govia Thameslink have outsourced all notice administration to that company, so in regards to notice queries you need to go through them [ZZPS] to deal with that..

zzps are not a parking co , they are debt collectors , law staes you appeal to PARKING Co , not monkey

waamo

If it's a penalty notice from Indigo at a railway station then ignore it. They can't do anything other than send scary letters.

Please note this advice only applies in these specific circumstances and other tickets should not be ignored.

J1234ST

@twhitehousescat - thanks, understood, however referring back to what is noted in the newbies thread, it states:

"The only thing to do differently with an INDIGO RAILWAY PENALTY (specifically only that type) is to WAIT for the first letter to arrive (as long as it's your own vehicle, not leased/hired) and do not rush to appeal on day 26 like with any other 'parking charge notice'. The reason is, these fake penalties go nowhere, and 'time out' after just 6 months. So at every stage, drag it out, and wait for the first letter before using the template appeal below. Then at POPLA stage - which is now available again for fake 'byelaws Penalties' like this one, don't rush. POPLA codes last 32 days, so appeal as late as possible and get to the six months and/or win at POPLA earlier by copying another byelaws POPLA appeal (search the forum)."

However, who am I supposed to respond to here, given that Indigo have told me that ZZPS now apparently deal with the notice administration? Should I be contacting ZZPS with the template below (amending to suit my case) as noted in the newbies thread? I'm hesitant to get in contact with the debt collector.

Re PCN number:

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a formal complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner and to my MP.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require ALL photos taken and an explanation of the allegation and your evidence, i.e.:

- If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in response to this appeal must include the record of payments made - showing partial VRNs - and an explanation of the reason for the PCN, because your Notice does not explain it.

- If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include the actual grace period agreed by the landowner. If you fail to evidence the actual grace period that applies at this site or suggest that only one period applies, this will be disregarded as an attempt to mislead. In the absence of evidence, it will be reasonably taken to be a minimum of twenty minutes (ten on arrival and ten after parking time) in accordance with the official BPA article by Kelvin Reynolds about 'observation periods' on arrival being additional and separate to a 'grace period' at the end.

- in all cases, you must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date.

Formal note:
Should you later pursue this charge by way of litigation, note that service of any legal documents by email is expressly disallowed and you are not entitled to assume that the data in this dispute/appeal remains the current address for service in the future.

Yours faithfully,



THE NAME AND POSTAL ADDRESS OF THE KEEPER (OR THE HIRER/LESSEE) GOES HERE.

THE DRIVER IS NOT IDENTIFIED.

J1234ST

@waamo - thanks. I never received an initial penalty notice from Indigo, only the debt collection notice from ZZPS who apparently now deal with the notice administration (according to Indigo). On the phone to Indigo they even said that a lot of initial penalty notices were never issued...

twhitehousescat

you can send that by mail , first class with proof of postage , asd a line "I want a as parking code to appeal" , expect either a code or the letter to get lost

you are just playing at wasting time here , a month for a reply , a month to fill appeal in etc etc

waamo

Do not ever ring a parking company. They will tell you anything to get you to pay.

Personally I would ignore it.

J1234ST

thanks @twhitehousecat, and you think send my 'request for a parking code to appeal' letter to Indigo still, and not ZZPS?

twhitehousescat

seems that all your paperwork says zzps , so how can you find indigo address

twhitehousescat

https://www.sabaparking.co.uk/news/blog/how-to-appeal-a-parking-ticket

caution for drop down boxes that change and incriminate you

J1234ST

I could write to Indigo, their website provides a postal address, and reference my Penalty Notice Number stated on the ZZPA debt collection notice, however it states online "Any appeal against this notice must be made online or in writing at the address below within 28 days of the day of issue." where I'm obviously outside of this window.