clam form - defence- help needed - ACE security services - Gladstone's

Le_Kirk

It's summer, it's week-end, only a small number of regular contributors! Anyway, are you defending as keeper or driver? If you are defending as keeper, how do you know so much about the circumstances of the incident? Did you have a conversation with the driver perhaps? Your point 2.7 is confusing, you perhaps need to explain the bit about the driver having called. Why are you referring to Highway Regulations if this is private parking? Are you suggesting that the vehicle was de facto authorised to park due to the driver having secured a visitor permit. Was the driver a visitor to the premises or a resident of the premises. Some of the later points such as no standing, should be in the defence and therefore do not need repeating in the Witness Statement, which after all is just the narrative of what happened on the day, which, as a keeper you would not know unless you have interrogated the driver.

kanjar13

Thank you for your reply, sorry stressing over all this a bit .
I am defending as a keeper.
The reason why I know all this is because I visited the place on a different day to take pictures of the signs, I specifically went around the same time the ticket was given. The driver was a visitor who obtained a visitors permit (permit basically covered one whole day but ticket was given after midnight so essentially a different day than the one shown on permit). Gladstones have emailed me pictures of the parked vehicle and the permit inside the car etc when I requested all the documents they had on file.

This is the first time I'm doing this so at a bit of a loss of how to proceed to be honest. The bit of the highway regulations is there because I have copied this from someone else and didn't take it out.

Do I need t prepare witness statement and then that's it?

Redx

Witness statement plus exhibits , as it tells you on your court letter , by the date the court said to be in by

Refer to the exhibits in the WS , I suggest you read recent court cases on here to see what they did and why

Le_Kirk

In your witness statement (WS) you need to make it clear that you are the RK, not the driver on the day but you have spoken at length with the driver, which is how you know so much about it. Try to make your WS flow so it becomes a story and, as Redx says refer to your exhibits and evidence.

You could look at the NEWBIE sticky post # 2 where you will find links to WSs which cannot just be copied blindly because they are not your story BUT you can take the STYLE from them

kanjar13

thanks guys, I am just writing a more concise and adequate draft and a draft post with all the questions I have and will post shortly instead of going back and forth every two seconds, thanks!

kanjar13

IN THE COUNTY COURT AT xxxxxxxx
CLAIM No. xxxxx

Between:

PACE RECOVERY AND STORAGE LIMITED (TRADING AS ACE SECURITY SERVICES (Claimant)

- and -

MR x x Of xx xxxx xxxxx (Defendant)

__________________________________________________________________________________
WITNESS STATEMENT – Mr xxx xxx
__________________________________________________________________________________

1. Preliminary

1.1 I, xxx xxxxx, of xxxxx xxxxxxx am the Registered Keeper in this case. I am unrepresented, with no experience of court procedures. If I do not set out documents in the correct way, I trust the court will excuse my inexperience.

1.2 Attached to this statement is a bundle of documents marked EX1, EX2 etc., to which I will refer.

1.3 The facts in this statement come from my personal knowledge. Where they are not within my own knowledge, they are true to the best of my information and belief.

1.4 The claim refers to an incident involving vehicle xxxx on xxxxxx at the location of Xx xx, London.

1.5 I am not liable to the Claimant for the sum claimed, or any amount at all, and this is my Witness Statement in support of my Defence already submitted.

2. Sequence of Events

2.1 I was not the driver on the day the alleged contravention took place but I have been in contact with the driver and the sequence of events reflects what happened on the day. I have also visited the place where my vehicle was parked around the same time the PCN occurred, took pictures of signage and surrounding area in order to give an adequate Witness Statement.

2.2 On xxxxx my vehicle was parked in a marked visitor bay allocated to guest visiting Xx xx. The vehicle was de facto “authorised” as a visitor and permitted to park at Xx xx. (See Exhibit EX1 - picture of a permit from the claimant’s bundle). The permit shows 21/05 and the PCN was given out after midnight so, essentially, 01/01 at 00:00 and this is, in my opinion, simply predatory. The fact that a permit was obtained shows that the driver was a genuine visitor, wasn’t trespassing and had no ill intentions.

2.3 Over 1 month after this occurred, I received correspondence “Notice to Keeper” from the Claimant (letter dated xx xxxx - Exhibit EX2 NTK) demanding “Payment for Charge Notice” is overdue for “Invalid Permit”. This was the first communication I had received on the matter and the letter was very vague.

2.4 I sent a reply letter (Exhibit EX3 Add first letter) on the xx xxxx to the Claimant stating that I was the registered keeper and suggested that they cancel this notice as no evidence was included.

2.5 The Claimant responded with another letter (Exhibit EX5) stating the driver called on the day of the Charge Notice and I had lost the right to appeal. I as the registered keeper was not aware the driver had called the Claimant. Having had no other correspondence from the Claimant I had assumed the matter closed.

2.6 On the xx xxx I received a “LETTER BEFORE CLAIM” from the Claimant’s solicitors (See Exhibit EX6) seeking recovery of debt for £160. The letter stated additional costs claimed by the claimant for the time spent and resources facilitating the recovery of the charge. I responded to this Letter of claim (See Exhibit EX7) stating that I did not agree I owed this debt. I also asked that they provide evidence of who is the owner of the car park, a copy of the contract between the claimant and owner and planning and advertising consent for the signage and all evidence held.

2.7 The Claimant’s solicitor did not respond to my 1st letter but sent a 2nd “LETTER BEFORE CLAIM” on the xxxx, See Exhibit EX8 again asking to pay this charge. I responded again via a letter and the Claimant’s Solicitors website that I was still waiting for a response from my first letter asking for the same information stated in the first letter. They finally responded via email on the xxxxx (Exhibit EX8 )stating that they had attached a bundle, which the claimant would rely on in court and does not include details of the owner or contract between their client (the Claimant) and landowner and planning applications is irrelevant to this charge. The Claimant’s solicitor also stated there would be no further correspondence and documentation will not be provided at this stage. There was NO bundle attached, I replied stating no bundle was attached, the claimants Solicitor did not respond until the xxxxxx with the Bundle.

2.8 After reviewing the Bundle which had 2 different signs that only stated “terms and conditions”

kanjar13

3. Inadequate Signage

3.1 Upon later investigation I drove to Xx xx, I could not see any clear or lit signage from my vehicle clearly indicating the parking restrictions (EX6 - picture entering Xx xx at 12am). The signs weren’t clearly visible when entering the development. When I stopped and parked my vehicle, there were no signs adjacent to the space, that could possibly be read from my vehicle. I believe that in the case of “Vine vs London Borough of Waltham Forest” the Court of Appeal ruled that a person cannot be presumed bound by terms and conditions on signage that they have not seen. In this case, which was found in favour of the motorist, the signage was deemed insufficient because there was no signage directly adjacent to the Appellant’s parking bay and the only signage that was displayed could not have been read from within the vehicle when parking, as in the case here (See Exhibit EX7 - Picture from inside car looking at the sign).

3.2 I approached the concierge office and nowhere outside or within the concierge office does it state any parking restriction or signage regarding to the parking in xx xx

3.2 When reviewing the signage at Xx xx it is difficult to read especially at night. A key factor in the case of “ParkingEye vs Beavis” was that the relevant signs were “large, prominent and legible so that any reasonable user of the car park would be aware of their existence and nature” and that “the charge is prominently displayed in large letters and at frequent intervals within it”. That is not the case here. (Exhibit EX8 picture of the sign from street level evidence)

3.3 The IPC guidelines (14) state ‘You must not use predatory or misleading tactics to lure drivers into incurring parking charges. Such instances will be viewed as a serious instance of non-compliance’. The signage as you enter Xx xx isn’t clearly visible, especially to someone entering at night and in a moving vehicle, it can be deemed predatory and opportunistic given out tickets to genuine vistors.


4 Declaration

I invite the Court to dismiss this claim in its entirety, and to award my costs of attendance at the hearing, such as are allowable pursuant to CPR 27.14.

Statement of Truth

I believe that the facts stated in this Witness Statement are true.


Signature

Date



Also:
Ok, while editing my witness statement I have a few questions. Would like to clear few things up before I continue with it

1. The driver did call ACE a day after and did say they were the driver but didn’t give their name (had no idea of how things worked then so hoped they would be reasonable and would throw it out, oh how wrong were they! Lol). If the convo was recorded it ill be easy for them to determine the keeper and driver were two different people (not sure that matters)
2. Since im defending as the keeper should I ignore everything before NTk ( I know this is obvious but they have sent me picture of permit inside the car that was taken when they gave out the original ticket so I’m assuming I can use that?). I did go to the place where the alleged contravention took place and specifically went around the time it all happened so I could take pictures, is it ok to use all of it in my witness statement as exhibits? And based on that van I write in my WS what I think happened?
3. 3. The reason I mention highway regulations is simply because I copied WS from another post and using it as a base so will take that out
4. Are gladstones going to be providing their own witness statement or do they not have to do that? If they are then will I be getting a copy of it?
5. Is WS best posted or can I email it?

KeithP

You have two paras 3.2.


3.3 refers to "IPC guidelines (14)"

Several points here:

1. you don't appear to have explained what 'IPC' means. Are you assuming the court knows? Spell it in full the first time you use it.
2. They are not guidelines. they are a Code of Practice, and the Beavis case stated that the parking company's trade associations code of practice is effectively law - because without abiding by the CoP the parking company has no authority to even get the keeper's details from the DVLA.
3. Are you expecting the court to believe what you allege is a quotation from the IPC's CoP? As well as quoting form it, you need to refer to the relevent paragraphs in your evidence. In other words, in your evidence have those paras in your bundle and in your WS refer to them as you have to other evidence - e.g. See exhibit EXnn.
4. what does the '(14)' mean?

kanjar13

KeithP wrote: »

You have two paras 3.2.


3.3 refers to "IPC guidelines (14)"

Several points here:

1. you don't appear to have explained what 'IPC' means. Are you assuming the court knows? Spell it in full the first time you use it.
2. They are not guidelines. they are a Code of Practice, and the Beavis case stated that the parking company's trade associations code of practice is effectively law - because without abiding by the CoP the parking company has no authority to even get the keeper's details from the DVLA.
3. Are you expecting the court to believe what you allege is a quotation from the IPC's CoP? As well as quoting form it, you need to refer to the relevent paragraphs in your evidence. In other words, in your evidence have those paras in your bundle and in your WS refer to them as you have to other evidence - e.g. See exhibit EXnn.
4. what does the '(14)' mean?

1. I have now changed IPC to their full name
2. changed guidelines to "code of practice"
3. ok added to para
3.4 The Independent Parking Committee (IPC) Code of Practice (14 Predatory Tactics 14.1 – See EX8)
4. 14 was basically point 14 from IPC CoP

does it all makes sense?

KeithP

Check again what IPC stands for.

This is simple stuff. Look again at the IPC's webpage or even their CoP.