Overcharged by plumber. What can I do?

Jackboy29

After some advice please.

recently smelt gas in my outside cupboard and phoned the gas board who were sending someone out. Plumber who lives down my road was passing so asked him and he said they will just cap it off and then I have to phone him to turn it back on so better to let him look first so I cancelled the guy from transco. He said I have a 1.8mb drop and probably the iron pipework underground so he said he could change it to copper. Said about half days work etc. He came back next week and did the work and he obviously wasn’t busy that day as he was slow and there were two guys and all very leisurely. The new pipe runs about 5 meters in total. Down inside the cupboard and out, about 3 meters along the front of the house and in to where the boiler sits. Checked it after and still got 1.8mb drop but now he was saying it was 8mb before and now it’s 2mb so still a leak some where. Called transco and guy came out and said old pressure regulator on meter always fail etc. So the work was probably unnecessary but there you go. Got the bill today. £637! Phoned him and said must be only about £50 parts and he reckons parts cost a lot more than that but !!!!!!. My old plumber laughed and reckons he is taking the p**s but said I should have got quote beforehand but equally he should have told me beforehand.

Any advice please? Can’t really afford this massive bill and seems like I’m being conned for the work that was done.

Thanks

Aylesbury_Duck

If the work has been itemised at that price and you asked him to carry it out, you’re a bit stuck. You appear to have authorised the work done without actually confirming what the problem was or how much it would cost. That’s clearly your error. Your estimate of £50 parts came from where?

I had a similar problem a few years ago, a leak in the carcass beneath the house. It cost me £800 for a new large-bore external pipe run all the way around the house (meter and boiler are diametrically opposite) with two smaller-bore feeds coming off for the gas fire and hob along the way, with new connections to both. It does suggest your £637 is on the high side but the time to verify that was before you asked them to go ahead.

Mr.Generous

Sounds like the Transco guy was talking bull to me or you misunderstood something. The drop test is measured with the supply off, so whether the regulator is giving the correct mb pressure or not it wouldn't affect the test. When the manometer is connected that shows the pressure it's charged to, so again the regulator isn't relevant. The manometer shows the drop, and although 1.8mb is tiny in 2 mins it is still a drop.


The plumber should have isolated each gas appliance in turn to see if it was the pipe runs or an appliance loosing gas, it would be impossible to know where the leak was just from testing a the meter once. Most likely places are where appliances connect or at compression joints. That's what leak detection spray is for.


Has the leak been sorted or is the money spent just to confirm the leak is somewhere up stream of your new pipework.

Jackboy29

Thanks for the reply so far. My understanding is gas was filled with pipe and pressurised and then stop lever turned off. You can then detect a leak from downstream of the stop lever but you aren’t able to distinguish between whether the leak comes from the pressure regulator or the iron pipe work as it’s all connected. As I had a small leak but also the smell of gas was present then this was something that had to be looked at. The iron pipe was replaced with copper pipe but there was still a drop. Pipe only runs to boiler. No other gas appliances. Transco guy turns up. Says these old pressure regulators always leak and we replace them on sight. No more leak. As we didn’t agree a price beforehand then the bill has to be reasonable. Guy is going to itemise bill for me but 6m good quality pipe is about £30 and then some bends and fittings for each end. We aren’t talking loads of material cost here. It’s 5m of 22mm copper pipe. Have done some reading and if I had agreed to £637 beforehand then I might have to pay. But if you don’t agree a price then what work is carried out has to be reasonable cost. I don’t think £637 is reasonable but asking for advice here. I will get some quotes done from other plumbers and then pay him what is reasonable and if he wants the full amount it can go to arbitration and they can decide if it’s fair. I think £637 to run 5m of pipe is incredible

Aylesbury_Duck

I agree that £637 is on the high side (compared to my cost for a much bigger piece of work) but if he can prove it's reasonable, what next?

He may have been unreasonable as a tradesman but you've definitely been negligent as a customer. The time to contest pricing was before the job was done. It wasn't a rushed job, you said yourself he came the week after the problem was noticed. Did it not occur to you at any point in that time to ask how much it might cost and to compare that to at least one other estimate? You may end up paying less than £637 but why put yourself through the hassle of contesting it and possible arbitration when you could have sorted it out beforehand. You've also probably spoiled what might have been a useful relationship: a friendly plumber on your doorstep.

Dodgy traders only survive because there are plenty of dodgy customers.

Jackboy29

Aylesbury_Duck wrote: »

I agree that £637 is on the high side (compared to my cost for a much bigger piece of work) but if he can prove it's reasonable, what next?

He may have been unreasonable as a tradesman but you've definitely been negligent as a customer. The time to contest pricing was before the job was done. It wasn't a rushed job, you said yourself he came the week after the problem was noticed. Did it not occur to you at any point in that time to ask how much it might cost and to compare that to at least one other estimate? You may end up paying less than £637 but why put yourself through the hassle of contesting it and possible arbitration when you could have sorted it out beforehand. You've also probably spoiled what might have been a useful relationship: a friendly plumber on your doorstep.

Dodgy traders only survive because there are plenty of dodgy customers.

I agree with everything you say and I should have checked the price beforehand. I suspect this guy is quite good at making it sound relatively trivial. After all it was only running a copper pipe a few meters. The legislation that covers this says that if a price isn’t agreed beforehand then what is charged has to be a reasonable price. So I am covered in any event but of course it is more agro for me but he is doing this everyday. Why didn’t he give me a price? I’m partly to blame but I don’t do this everyday like he does. If he doesn’t give me a price beforehand then he accepts that what he charges he has to be reasonable. It’s more agro for him as he has to claim. I will have to get several quotes from other gas safe plumbers and if they all day £637 then I’ll pay. If they all say £300 then I’ll pay £300

bris

As a gas engineer I would have traced the leak before doing any work. To just guess and replace pipes not needing replaced is bad practice.


You shouldn't have cancelled Transco, they make sure their side is safe then cap your side, If you let then come then they would have found and fixed it.


I would tell the plumber they did unnecessary work that should never have been done and threaten to make a complaint to the Gas Safe Register. They may but probably not investigate but making up work isn't something they will take to kindly too.

Aylesbury_Duck

Jackboy29 wrote: »

I agree with everything you say and I should have checked the price beforehand. I suspect this guy is quite good at making it sound relatively trivial. After all it was only running a copper pipe a few meters. The legislation that covers this says that if a price isn’t agreed beforehand then what is charged has to be a reasonable price. So I am covered in any event but of course it is more agro for me but he is doing this everyday. Why didn’t he give me a price? I’m partly to blame but I don’t do this everyday like he does. If he doesn’t give me a price beforehand then he accepts that what he charges he has to be reasonable. It’s more agro for him as he has to claim. I will have to get several quotes from other gas safe plumbers and if they all day £637 then I’ll pay. If they all say £300 then I’ll pay £300

It doesn't sound like you need any advice. You're covered by legislation, you're sure of your position, you'll end up paying the appropriate amount, so why ask us?

ceredigion

Jackboy29 wrote: »

I agree with everything you say and I should have checked the price beforehand. I suspect this guy is quite good at making it sound relatively trivial. After all it was only running a copper pipe a few meters. The legislation that covers this says that if a price isn’t agreed beforehand then what is charged has to be a reasonable price. So I am covered in any event but of course it is more agro for me but he is doing this everyday. Why didn’t he give me a price? I’m partly to blame but I don’t do this everyday like he does. If he doesn’t give me a price beforehand then he accepts that what he charges he has to be reasonable. It’s more agro for him as he has to claim. I will have to get several quotes from other gas safe plumbers and if they all day £637 then I’ll pay. If they all say £300 then I’ll pay £300

I trust that you will offer some recompense for wasting the time and resources of these trades men. As a respectable house holder you would have no intension of "coning" them in to providing a services for you under false pretensions would you.

Jackboy29

Aylesbury_Duck wrote: »

It doesn't sound like you need any advice. You're covered by legislation, you're sure of your position, you'll end up paying the appropriate amount, so why ask us?

Just to check I guess

Jackboy29

ceredigion wrote: »

I trust that you will offer some recompense for wasting the time and resources of these trades men. As a respectable house holder you would have no intension of "coning" them in to providing a services for you under false pretensions would you.

Yes. I know quite a few plumbers who would give me a realistic price and put their name to it and I’m happy to pay them for their time. As long as they don’t take the p*ss!