SAR refused!

Coupon-mad

3 The Claimants original PCN was issued on 23th October 2018. The POFA Paragraph 8(2)(f) requires that any notice to keeper gives 28 days from the day after the day the notice was given for full payment or the details of the driver. The repeat PCN was issued on 20th November, which is non-compliant with POFA conditions.

That is wrong and I already advised you that, as you have said who was driving, there's no point mentioning the POFA/keeper liability.

Is this right, are you saying you were not sent any LBC, e.g. by a solicitor?

4 The Claimants defence pack does not include any ‘letter before Claim’. Nor is it contained in the subject data access request that I received via email on 30th Jan 2019. Therefore, the defendant asserts that Manor parking have not complied with pre- action protocol for debt claims and have issued a premature claim.

I am not seeing what your defence actually is, given you presumably paid for 2 hours but stayed for 27 minutes too long. Why are you saying a Judge should find you not liable, given you must have read the signs to have paid?

Was the penalty in tiny writing, much smaller than the tariffs?

Robbishon

Hi

I thought mentioning the POFA paragraph 8 etc rule demonstrated the fact that I was not given a full 28 days before the repeat notice was issued demanding the full £100 charge. As a forum member previously mentioned that this process has been expeditious.

Yes it is right- I have not been sent any LBC by a solicitor.

Oh dear! I thought those were my defences.

I couldn’t have noted the tariff from the signs. I most probably noted the tariff from the coin collection machine. You can’t read the sign from the car as It is located a distance into the car park, raised on a pole and if I was to stop to read it anyway I would be blocking other patrons coming in as it is single lane traffic. It is awkward.

I did consider using the ‘grace period’ argument but didn’t think it applied for 27mins. Even thou one of the businesses round there was having some major construction work going on and on occasion there was a delay in parking due to having to wait for various workers to move vans or finish deliveries.

nosferatu1001

No point in mentioning POFA. None.

Yes they were quick, but you need to then allege they broke the code of practice, and the only way they should be able to charge this amount is by meeting ALL the Beavis requirements, of which meeting the code of practice was ONE element

Robbishon

I found the below advice whilst trying to research this


“No legitimate interest in enforcing a charge – One of the key points from the Beavis case was that the charge was necessary to deter overstaying; if they did not issue penalties then the car park would be unfairly used. The flip side of this is that if there were no legitimate interest, then the charge would be an unenforceable penalty…

The following are examples of charges that are arguably therefore penalties:

Parking in a space you own but forgetting to display your permit
Entering an incorrect VRN into a terminal
Underpaying in a car park where by paying the vehicle is fully entitled to be there
Parking outside a bay when no other cars are stopped from parking”

Should I be using this as a defence also? I do have an email where I offered to pay the alleged overstay amount.

I’m not normally intimidated easily but this has got me really down. I don’t seem to have a clue despite everything I read. I suppose I’m ‘fighting’ with my heart rather than my head and at this point I feel like just giving up the ghost and giving them what they want..me and the kids will eat beans for the next month!

In all honesty do you think I even have a case?

Robbishon

I have paid the parking amount £125. I feel so very defeated as I didn’t do anything wrong but I don’t feel that the law will support me. Nor do I have the expertise to understand what the hell is going on. I apologise for wasting your time. All your help is greatly appreciated. I have a lot going on in my life right now and this could just be the straw that broke the camels back. Without trying to sound cliche I really do hope you all continue to help commoners like myself as your service is really valuable. Thank you.

Coupon-mad

£125? I thought you had a claim for £185, did they agree to accept £125?

I think that decision is sad but wise, as I said, I was struggling to see what your defence would have been to staying an extra 25 minutes and not paying for another hour.

Redx

same sentiments as above


when people get a PCN its always worth sitting down and deciding what the circumstances were, and what possible defence (if any) is applicable


judges take a dim view of not paying , or of not paying enough at the time , plus not trying to rectify matters on the day by buying another ticket or whatever


had the overstay been a lot less then GRACE PERIODS come into it , but 25 minutes is hard to justify, especially when a certain time WAS paid for , meaning the driver was aware of the parking rules and conditions and had accepted them with the initial payment


POFA can play a part as long as a driver is not divulged , but knowing when to quit or when you have messed up is half the battle


my wife told my son to buy another ticket in an NCP car park when they "overstayed" (and kept both tickets) and copies of both tickets were presented at the appeal stage resulting in a cancellation , but my good lady has more idea about this topic having put up with me for several years advising her on these matters , lol


it is what it is , and sometimes you cannot defend these with little or no evidence


I am sure this will have taught you a lot and hopefully how to avoid getting more, or what to do if it happens again

Robbishon

£125 was still on their system when I logged into their website. You’ve probably heard it a million times but I’m not a dishonest person nor am I shirker - had I of realised on the day I would have paid more ( I claim back for travel/parking expenses) and hence offered payment once I knew what was going on. As it stands I went work that day just to pay for this parking ticket - I’m hurt but would have been more hurt going to court just to plead with a judge for no legal reason at all and loosing more money as they where claiming £260 with solicitor costs.

That car park will never get my money again.

Whoever said that these charges are not unfair shouldn’t be allowed to speak for me ...there’s a vast difference between a judges wages and mine but hey ho so it goes. Can I repeat my thanks and apologies for wasting your time really. You really are an intelligent bunch and I felt really supported by all your help. I will keep visiting my MP (the useless lump!!) and pushing the matter. Wishing you all the very best x

Coupon-mad

£125 was still on their system when I logged into their website.

they where claiming £260 with solicitor costs.

You haven't paid the claim off then, sorry.

You can't do that and you STILL have a claim in play, and if you fail to now submit a WS and evidence they will ask the Judge for their legal rep's costs for turning up (could be £180 on top) due to you not following the court directions or turning up to the hearing that they will attend.

waamo

Paying off what is on their system went out the window a fair while ago. You either need to pay the whole amount on the claim form or negotiate a lower payment.