Advice about a delayed parking fine

CainDingle

Ahh I see the distinction, thanks.

And noted, I'll be sure to keep that out of my vocabulary, at least for the immediate issue

I guess now I just wait for the NTH

CainDingle

Doing my research on the matter, I came across a paragraph in PoFA.

Paragraph 13, subsection 2 states:

The creditor may not exercise the right under paragraph 4 to recover from the keeper any unpaid parking charges specified in the notice to keeper if, within the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which that notice was given, the creditor is given—
(a)a statement signed by or on behalf of the vehicle-hire firm to the effect that at the material time the vehicle was hired to a named person under a hire agreement;
(b)a copy of the hire agreement; and
(c)a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement.


Subsection 5 of the same paragraph states:

The documents mentioned in sub-paragraph (2) must be given by—
(a)handing them to the creditor;
(b)leaving them at any address which is specified in the notice to keeper as an address at which documents may be given to the creditor or to which payments may be sent; or
(c)sending them by post to such an address so that they are delivered to that address within the period mentioned in that sub-paragraph.


Does this mean they have 28 days to serve me the correct documents through the post? And would this begin with the date of the citation, or the date which I received the email informing me of the citation?

Coupon-mad

You need to read para 14, and Edna Basher's appeal for hirers which explains it all (see NEWBIES thread section about hire cars and the links to example appeals for this situation - of course, NOT the Fleet Manager one).

CainDingle

Ahh ok. So after re-reading paragraphs 13-14, I can see that PoFA gives them the right to recover the money from the rental company if they can't get the money from me. But only after they've served me with all the correct documents. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Is there any time limit on how long they are allowed to take in serving me these documents? I can't make out from the PoFA document if there is a limit.

Coupon-mad

The NEWBIES thread section about lease cases tells you the deadline (I just checked as I was sure I had put it there...)!

The sticky thread is there to relieve the burden on single threads.

No parking firm get the POFA right in hirer cases.

CainDingle

21 days after they were informed of the hirer's details? Do I assume that is the date on the document that the hiring company emailed to me?

Sorry if I seem a bit jittery, everyone I know keeps advising me to just pay it to 'take the stress away from me', but I am determined to fight this!

Just a bit of a new thing for me, so I am on unsure ground.

Coupon-mad

21 days after they were informed of the hirer's details? Do I assume that is the date on the document that the hiring company emailed to me?

Yes. Calm the jitters.

You can't get much easier than a BPA member parking firm, mucking up a NTH!

And Minster Baywatch too...there are a couple of recent POPLA appeals on the forum about them and their silly signs in the wrong name. Maybe you will get lucky with the signs as well, they often have signs with with Bransby Wilson on it instead of MB.

Not Blossom Street. or Cathedral car park, is it? If so, search the forum and laugh!

CainDingle

Thanks.

It's the one on King St in Oldham. The Mecca bingo.

I had a quick scout and found someone who beat them at said car park because the lettering on the sign is 3x too small for it being on an access road

MistyZ

CainDingle,

your killer point is going to be non-compliance with PoFA i.e. absence of hire docs. and should be the first section of your POPLA appeal. And you are right to start scouting around for other relevant points.

As I understand it, the font size on signs is invariably smaller than it should be. You could do with some good photos of the car park, signage .... everything. Take loads if possible then sit back and look at them objectively, it is likely that you will find much to criticise.

Don't listen to those who say 'pay', that's just ignorance. That's not a criticism, most people know diddley squat about the Big Parking Scam till they really look into it.

The_Deep

But what is a charge? Surely a PPC's invoice for a disputed breach of contract cannot be a charge, even in a yellow and black striped envelope. What value have they supplied

Do the T & C define the word? And why should car hire company pay it when it can be appealed.

Complain to your Local Trading Standards Department about Enterprise, and your MP about the PPC.

The whole industry is a scam, relying on threats of court, and the public's ignorance of the Law, A bill is currently before parliament which will regulate the scammers, many of whom are ex-clampers.

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors. Is has been suggested by an MP that some of these companies may have connections to organised crime.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, (especially Smart}, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week), hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

The problem has become so widespread that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers.

Sir Greg Knight's Private Members Bill to curb the excesses, and perhaps close down, some of these companies passed its Second Reading in the Lords this month, and, with a fair wind, will l become Law later this year..

All five readings are available to watch on the internet, (some 7-8 hours), and published in Hansard. MPs have an extremely low opinion of the industry. Many are complaining that they are becoming overwhelmed by complaints from members of the public. Add to their burden, complain in the most robust terms about the scammers.