Brexit the economy and house prices part 7: Brexit Harder

Tromking

SouthLondonUser wrote: »

Ah, I see. So your opinion rests on the assumptions that:

1) the Leave voters you speak to are representative of ALL the leave voters in the country, and that

2) they were sincere and didn't hide their most racist tendencies.

You have completely blown me away with your bullet-proof logic!

I bring to this discussion only my honest opinion based on my life experience, past and present. Sorry.
I could post links like you do that only confirm my personal bias, but that’s not my style.

Herzlos

I've seen plenty of comments harking back to the Glory days of empire, or how things were so much better before the EU and so on. Usually from quite old, quite right-wing Tories, but they certainly voted based on it.

Takedap wrote: »

Maybe because they didn't convert their empires into a "Commonwealth"?

What actually makes a Commonwealth different from an Empire? Did anywhere else in the Commonwealth actually become wealthy or did it all trickle back to London?

Tromking

The only harking back to the days of empire I’ve seen of late has been the poor people of Hong Kong handing out the old HK colonial flag to protesters at the weekend.
Funny that.

Rinoa

The Irish Government has published a document this afternoon on the latest state of their Brexit planning. If there is no deal, they say that various checks on UK imports will be necessary “to preserve Ireland’s full participation in the Single Market and Customs Union”, but – surprise, surprise – these checks don’t need to happen at the border itself. Confirming what everybody knew at the very start of the negotiations before the issue was deliberately blown out of all proportion…

Gives Ireland and the EU a pretty simple choice: agree a deal with these sorts of alternative arrangements in place of the backstop – or have no deal and have to put the arrangements in place anyway, with no cash from the UK and all the other complications it will bring. Not exactly a tricky decision…

https://order-order.com/

BikingBud

SouthLondonUser wrote: »

I asked for a comment on the FCO's bit about nostalgia. I didn't get any. Was that point wrong? Why?
Sadly, no reply. Am I going to get the usual angry replies shouting back I am not entitled to an answer, if I stress that?

Like back in May, I'd be inclined to point out that only a hermit country like North Korea is fully sovereign. Any interaction with other countries involves giving up a modicum of sovereignty. The point Brexiters miss in their delusions is that, by going it alone, the UK would be less sovereign because it would have less bargaining power and would be forced to accept things which it can now deny by being part of the larger, stronger EU, like chlorinated chicken.

You want us to comment upon a single comment, within a single paper, within a file of docs gathered together by the civil servants of the FCO that is merely opinion, the same as we have recently seen from the Ambassador to the USA. And the opinion the Saddam Hussien held WMD and could attack us within 45 mins. None of them are statements of fact. They merely provide someone's perspective, as advice to those in Government. I also mentioned in May "think about Sir Humphrey".

Nor is the opinion that leaving without a deal will lead to a knife edge crash to doom and despondency a fact, merely just another opinion.

Why do you assume we will roll over and get our bellies tickled rather than being robust in our post brexit activities? Oh yes our weak politicians who cannot even manage to leave the party and close the door afterwards.

What we do have is the kind of peer pressure that leads to addiction; go on just a quick puff you don't need to inhale, yeah sure I can get you some more but it will cost you now, no you cannot have any more until you've paid off the debt. We need to break the habit and our relationship. Move on and be self reliant.

More than 50% of the chicken that is exported comes from Europe, US roughly 8%.

Notwithstanding these points, what is wholly disconcerting is your perpetual assumption that all people who voted to leave are racists. Is that based upon the leavers you know and their blatant racist tendencies or just you opinion based upon your own spite and deep seated prejudices?

Arklight

Based on the experience of many Remainers, many Leavers do seem a bit racist, yes.

I think most of us could predict fairly accurately which of our colleagues and family members were going to vote Leave.

I was surprised by a few, mostly older female colleagues. But it turned out that before they "won" they apparently hadn't felt free to speak their minds.

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

melanzana

UK is looking very divided now. Was that the intention?

Awful vista IMO. But some gloat and wish for the break up. That will happen no question.

So Brexit is really a Wales/England issue now. That is obvious.

Honestly what has this country achieved at all from all this. Nothing except a break up of the Union, but that's ok, it's worth it.

My word. I cannot believe this is happening.

Arklight

Yes it doesn't look good. If you'd told me in 2014 that we were going to get a creep like Boris Johnson as PM I'd never have thought it possible.

smipsy

Boris was always going to be the PM.

He's like a movie villain whom you follow from the beginning and you know the climax will be with him getting what he wants.

I'm just undecided on whether it's a thriller, comedy or a horror movie!

lisyloo

Arklight wrote: »

Based on the experience of many Remainers, many Leavers do seem a bit racist, yes.

I think most of us could predict fairly accurately which of our colleagues and family members were going to vote Leave.

I was surprised by a few, mostly older female colleagues. But it turned out that before they "won" they apparently hadn't felt free to speak their minds.

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

My mum voted leave. She adopted and brought up a mixed race child in the 1970s when that was unusual in a white village.

My brother voted leave and he has a Thai wife but agrees with controlled immigration.

Some are racist for sure but I don’t think you can tar everyone with the same brush. There are many intelligent leavers who can articulate their reasons but to understand that you have to listen to their views without pre conceived ideas.