Brexit the economy and house prices part 7: Brexit Harder

Arklight

cogito wrote: »

You know how much Airbus received in illegal subsidies from the EU?

Twenty two billion euros


When I say the EU, I mean taxpayers in member countries of the EU so hazarding a guess, I would think that 2-3bn has come from the UK.
The thing is that without the taxpayer helping them out, this business would have gone down the pan years ago. And now we have the CEO of this company threatening to move his business out of the UK when what he probably wants is for the UK taxpayer to stump up more cash to persuade him to stay and our government is probably stupid enough to fall for it.

A rather one sided view of this issue considering the enormous amount of revenue the UK's involvement in Airbus has brought in. It does fit in with the slash and burn mentality of the Brexiters.

On Brexit Farm the logic is that if the fields are all charred and barren then we won't have to bother getting the crops in next summer.

Airbus receives state subsidies otherwise it wouldn't be able to compete with Boeing, which receives colossal amounts of state aid from the US government. This is not very well hidden behind blank cheque R&D contracts, supposedly for military purposes but in effect an enormous tax payer handout to a national champion.

The British of course, are terrible at even noticing national champions, let alone trying to do anything to help them grow.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41152544

All major planemakers receive subsidies from governments. How much they get and in what form has kept these two at loggerheads. Boeing has the upper hand in the argument over who's guilty of receiving most aid.

But the biggest challenge to both these companies may yet come from the mother of all state subsidisers: China. If it's subsidies you don't like, then they must hate the state-owned Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China.

Comac has big plans to loosen the Airbus and Boeing stranglehold on commercial aircraft. Boeing sources tell me that the only reason they haven't taken a case against Comac to the WTO is that they cannot point to any commercial harm - yet.

kabayiri

gfplux wrote: »

How does Brexit help. It does not unless you are suggesting that desperation caused by Brexit will wake up this or any future Government.

Almost like suggesting that a new start after an apocalypse is a good thing.

Perhaps Brexiters have finally realised that this is the only way to squeeze a benefit out of Brexit.

The apocalypse is best kept for global war; huge natural disasters; and pandemics.

We *could* be in a period of extended decline in living standards. It's our 'roundabout' as the Asian 'swings' get ever higher.

A managed decline need not be a disastrous thing though, if we focus on sustainability and what really matters.

For me, EU+FOM == rampant growth and consumerism. Millions more people; every decade; with limited homes and limited transport and limited resources.

Brexit isn't an automatic answer to anything, but it is an opportunity to reappraise where we have got to, and what we want to do in the future.

All I get by way of vision from Corbyn is some 1970s throwback. How depressing.

Herzlos

To me, Brexit doesn't even seem to be a potential answer to anything; there's no detail on even "what if" scenarios about what we could do differently, and how the EU restricts that.


EU+FOM == growth, sure, but they growth is fairly good and should hit some equilibrium. It's already tailed off since we made it less economically viable to be here, and we have abilities we don't already use.


If we're forcing ourselves into a post-growth era, how are we meant to be managing that change?

movilogo

Why there is still fight whether Brexit is good/bad? The vote happened 3 years back and people spoken on what they want.

If people want tea (= leave) there is not much point in trying to convince why coffee ( = remain) is better for health.

Both are healthy beverages with pros and cons. If customer (= electorates) wants tea (= Brexit) the shop (= politicans) should simply brew it and serve hot.

Imgaine going to a cafe, order tea and then chef coming to your desk shouting why you must order coffee, then give you a long lecture why you should change your mind about tea and start drinking coffee.


That customer possibly also drinks coffee other times. But if you drink him/her coffee at gunpoint, s/he will be put off drinking coffee for life.

Get on with Brexit, see how life is outside EU, offer another referendum in 5 years time and see what people say that time.

mayonnaise

After months of droning on about how 'her deal is the only possible deal', Theresa is now speaking in the Commons proposing to reopen it. Something the EU already said 'no' to.

Oh dear...oh dear....

movilogo

EU parliament to back visa-free travel for Britons after Brexit - even if there is No Deal

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6643569/EU-parliamentarians-visa-free-travel-Britons-Brexit.html

Another project fear proven wrong

Herzlos

movilogo wrote: »

EU parliament to back visa-free travel for Britons after Brexit - even if there is No Deal

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6643569/EU-parliamentarians-visa-free-travel-Britons-Brexit.html

Another project fear proven wrong

It's just a proposal at this stage but hopefully it gets approved and covers work and study without a reciprocation clause.

StevieJ

movilogo wrote: »

EU parliament to back visa-free travel for Britons after Brexit - even if there is No Deal

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6643569/EU-parliamentarians-visa-free-travel-Britons-Brexit.html

Another project fear proven wrong

Does that mean Visa free travel for Europeans over here?

Arklight

movilogo wrote: »

EU parliament to back visa-free travel for Britons after Brexit - even if there is No Deal

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6643569/EU-parliamentarians-visa-free-travel-Britons-Brexit.html

Another project fear proven wrong

Another; what was the first one?

BobQ

Sky reports that there may be a solution to May's problem. The Joint Interpretive Agreement.

This is what they did when Canada - EU deal hit the rough waters.

http://data.consilium.europa.eu/doc/document/ST-13541-2016-INIT/en/pdf

An addendum to the Withdrawal Agreement, a true Euro fudge