Brexit the economy and house prices part 7: Brexit Harder

Herzlos

kabayiri wrote: »

I bet you use a US designed phone; laptop; chips in your telly. I would wager you buy from US etailers, or use US money transaction systems.

I bet your computer uses US inspired software.

But somehow you think we aren't linked?

Let's face it. There are companies driving the agenda now; not politicians.

Uber; Airbnb; Paypal; Facebook; Google. These and the people behind them are driving the way things are going.

Don't you think the likes of Amazon lobby government on things like flexible work hours etc? Of course they do.

I just formalize it a bit, that's all.

I've also got Chinese designed and built stuff but no inclination to become communist.

We've got a very superficial similarity to America, which you'd have seen from American co-workers if your international work goes that way, due to Holywood and a shared language. We're much closer in outlook to western Europe than America despite the language barrier.

America still notionally leads the world in technology, but China is fast catching up. America is usually mid-table for most metrics, though. Anything that helps other people is looked at with disdain for being communist. Health care sucks, workers rights suck, their tax system sucks, their view on gun safety sucks.
America is great if you're well off, but it sucks for everyone else.

Herzlos

kabayiri wrote: »

The funny thing is, the SNP frequently moan about how Westminster doesn't reflect the needs of Scotland, and yet believes that Brussels does ! :rotfl:

Scotland will get a lot more actual sovereignty (and prosperity) being a in the EU, than it gets Under Westminster. Especially under a UK outside of the EU.

Arklight

kabayiri wrote: »

I bet you use a US designed phone; laptop; chips in your telly. I would wager you buy from US etailers, or use US money transaction systems.

I bet your computer uses US inspired software.

But somehow you think we aren't linked?

Let's face it. There are companies driving the agenda now; not politicians.

Uber; Airbnb; Paypal; Facebook; Google. These and the people behind them are driving the way things are going.

Don't you think the likes of Amazon lobby government on things like flexible work hours etc? Of course they do.

I just formalize it a bit, that's all.

As much as I am not bought in to the peasants' revoluton of Brexit I have to say you appear to have missed the point of it by a country mile.

Arklight

Herzlos wrote: »

Do you think we'd be an equal partner in a union with the US? We'd get to be a 51st state at best, with no control over anything at a federal level.

Having lived in the US for a few years, I'd rather we went full North Korea than became part of the USA.

I have spent months in that awful country of the years for work and I can think of few places I would less like the UK to become like.

StevieJ

Arklight wrote: »

Yes that's just what the UK needs. A proper dose of American corporatism. Pampered Brits will soon buck their ideas up when they only get 10 days holiday a year and have virtually every recognisable employment right removed, including paid maternity leave.

And the security arrangements work brilliantly too. Dragged into most conflicts that have nothing to do with us apart from Vietnam will become a state of permanent war. But we're already fully onboard with torturing people through extraordinary rendition, entombing them in Guantanamo with no evidence and recourse to law, and spying on our allies. Including ourselves, so we may as well go the whole way and become the 51st state.

I am especially looking forward to Brexiters getting their heads around submitting their own tax returns and trying to find a medical insurance policy they can afford that only has a 50% co-pay.

Perpetual war, 51st state (or rather 'airstrip one') where have I read that before?:(

kabayiri

Arklight wrote: »

As much as I am not bought in to the peasants' revoluton of Brexit I have to say you appear to have missed the point of it by a country mile.

It never was about the peasants Arky.

I know you have these Citizen Smith fantasies, but it was only a sitcom :rotfl:

Kohoutek

kabayiri wrote: »

The depressing vision is being stuck in an increasingly moribund EU.

Our size in the EU does not matter one bit now. We have demonstrated our lack of commitment to the political project with a very public vote, and followed it up with 2 years of acrimonious negotiations.

We won't be a player in the EU direction regardless of what happens at the end of March. We would be a passenger.

Nice to know you believe in a strategy based on mantras and assertions.

To say we'd "be a passenger" in the EU is absurd given we'd be second/third largest economy, second largest population and largest/second largest military. Size matters, as the UK is finding out trying to negotiate with the EU27.

You might also want to consider that the UK has rarely been outvoted in the EU (despite the myths propagated by the right wing press) and contributed a lot to EU legislation (e.g. financial services).

kabayiri

Nope.

We'd be outside the Eurozone, and the driving force for integration comes from those with shared currency IMO.

But feel free to believe we haven't undermined our credentials...maybe you were asleep for the last few years.

Kohoutek

kabayiri wrote: »

Nope.

We'd be outside the Eurozone, and the driving force for integration comes from those with shared currency IMO.

But feel free to believe we haven't undermined our credentials...maybe you were asleep for the last few years.

Okay, so your argument that the UK's long term strategy should be becoming the 51st state is that we're not in the Eurozone (we weren't for 17 years before Brexit either and neither are 8 other EU member states) and Brexit has "undermined our credentials" (even though leaders of member states / EU officials have said they would prefer the UK not to leave).

What was the argument about becoming supine to the US again?

cogito

Herzlos wrote: »

Scotland will get a lot more actual sovereignty (and prosperity) being a in the EU, than it gets Under Westminster. Especially under a UK outside of the EU.

You mean in the EU which is poised to enter its third recession in a decade? Some prosperity.

Ask the young unemployed of most of Southern Europe how prosperous they feel.