Outfox The Market Direct Debit changes

wild666

I moved to these cowboys after they were mentioned on here. My yearly usage including gas was around 3100 and the price was so much cheaper than the monthly DD I was paying British Gas, £57 against OFTM £34, I use very little electric and virtually no gas.
After BG f*cked me over with the meter reading incurring a £260 debt minus my first months payment, of £255 I was quickly on to them, they didn't explain how they had got the reading for my smart meter, now a dumb meter, it took me 3 months to work out they had given them the reading minus the units I had used in the free time period, nearly 1900 units, and after getting it altered and me screwing up again, I didn't know the meter saved numerous readings. it was about 5 months down the line that I realised the reading was split into 3 parts, the grand total, ACT 1 & ACT 2. I decided I would email them each month with these readings and so I did and they have been using the free time readings ever since to work out my monthly bill.
I have one question for OFTM are they having money problems? The DD is supposed to split your yearly estimated bill into 12 equal payments and they want to charge us a higher fee for 6 months who the f*ck do they think they are? TV Licensing!

wild666

As the title says you should be 2 months payments in credit, at least, then you send them your meter reading to an email address, can't remember it off hand but they then work out your bill, or they should then refund you on it if you are still over 2 months in credit. that the way I read it in their BS email. It's not as if I can't afford the winter monthly payments it's just that a direct debit is supposed to be one twelfth of the yearly estimated total. I with I hadn't joined them and gone to my other choice BULB.

headlight1

"Could someone advise me regarding the situation of an account being substantially in credit. Can you request and demand that the energy provider pays money back into your bank account?"

Unfortunately it is not that simple with OTM as they are using their own "unique" interpretation of OFGEM guidelines.
I spoke to OTM last night.
I am 6 moths into an 18 month fixed term contract with them & am already nearly £400 in credit.
They intend to increase my DD from £120 to £180 to "more fairly represent my usage" so a hike of £60 a month for 6 months or £360.
I asked could they not just use my £400 credit to offset the DD hike & keep my DD at £120.
They told me that they are not "allowed" to do that.
Allowed by whom I do not know.
I asked could I have the £400 refunded so that I could use it to cover the extra £360 they intend charging me.
They said that OFGEM guidelines state that they must hold at least 2 months worth of DD"S in credit to "protect" the customer from unexpectedly high bills.
That 2 months of credit is based on my new £180 DD & not my present £120.
Therefore they could either keep £360 of my money in credit & refund me £40 or keep £360 & reduce my next 12 bills by £40/12 = £4 making my new DD £176 & not £180.
Personally I think that they are making things up as they go along & I am now weighing up whether to leave them, which will cost me a £100 exit fee, & hope I get the remaining £300 credit back or stay with them until they undoubtedly go bust in which case my £400 credit, which is increasing each month as I am over paying, "should" be covered by OFGEM.
I suggest that everyone emails Martin Lewis as OTM was suggested on his MSE site.
His email is Martinlewis@itv.com
Maybe he can give them some bad publicity on national TV for the way they are treating their customers

jimroy

I received yet another email from OFTM yesterday like others readjusting my ddr's again. Yet, the amounts are the same as they were in the first adjustment. The previous ones quoted were never in the original email. They're higher. They never quoted me those.

I wasn't too bothered with the original quotes as they were not much different to what I'm paying now. But they are less than my usage and not enough to cover them. The inflated ones as referenced yesterday as the previous ones are the other way; more than my usage.

I noticed that they put my membership bracket up one a few months back due to my electricity usage spiking over two months in the summer. (I had a lot of fans on mid summer due to the heatwave). This was unusual for me and not as they say based on historical usage. It remains to be seen if they will reduce my membership bracket down again "accordingly." I'm not holding my breath.
They didn't inform me of this change incidentally. I just noticed it on a subsequent bill.

And they want me to submit photographic evidence of my most recent readings now too in yesterday's email I notice. I've been submitting monthly readings religiously. To me it's sending a signal that they don't know where they're up to or what they're doing which concerns me as I'm in an 18 month contract with them until October next year.

dprice8893

I use about £650 of gas and electricity per year and currently I'm £149 in credit. OFTM's intended DD increase is from £62 to £87 pm.

I know savings interest rates are low, however, I'd rather have my money in my account than theirs.

dprice8893

Organza_Lace wrote: »

Thats not too bad an increase. If they had increased my winter DD by that much i'd have stuck with them.

That's the revised DD. They originally wanted to up it to £110 pm.


I know there prices are very competitive, but with most of their customers being fairly switch savvy, as soon as the situation changes, they might find there's a mass exodus.

wild666

martyp wrote: »

Good to see a thread is already going on this as I'm disgruntled as well, albeit a fair amount less impacted than others by the looks of it.
I switched in September and have so far endured a price rise for each month since but the direct debit think is less than pleasing. I was pleased to be paying just £40 a month for my electricity and gas and with my previous suppliers was also paying under £50 a month for both. Now I'm being advised over £70 a month for the winter then £30 a month for the Summer months. Not great to have a nearly doubled direct debit right before Christmas...
I argued the case on chat (looks like I'm lucky to have got that according to other reports on here) and got a fantastic response that this Winter is the harshest one for years???!!
I was curious to know how they knew that as so far it's been mild...
I also pointed out that paying just under £50 a month with my previous suppliers I ended up with about £150 credit balance when I switched and barely ever went into debit.
The response was that I could request a refund and that everyone was affected the same, chat as follows (advisor name removed as don't want to incriminate them as they were probably just saying as advised):

[FONT=&quot]Me: Is it possible to opt out of the direct debit arrangement? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Advisor: All customer's are affected by this change Sir [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Me: I prefer to have a regular fixed monthly payment and the plan is nearly twice what I pay at the moment right before Christmas [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]With my old supplier I paid about £50 all year round and ended up with a credit balance [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Advisor: We do understand your concern Sir [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This change is being implemented so that your account does not go into debt during the winter - one of the harshest in recent years [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Me: The estimate is based on me having very high usage over winter but I think this would result in me having a big credit balance. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]How do you know it would be one of the harshest as it's been very mild so far? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Advisor: Sir with regards to your credit balance, if you are very high in credit we can request a refund [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This would be better than being in debt [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Me: I stayed in credit with both my previous suppliers paying about £50 a month all year round. £70+ a month is way more than the £40 a month I'm paying now and right before Christmas is when I need the money the most so December isn't a good time for me [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]How much would I need to be in credit for to get a refund as I may ask when I'm £100 in credit [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Advisor: I do understand this [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Me: I had about £150 credit balance when I switched over [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Advisor: Sir whenever you do think you're too high in credit simply contact us and we will request a refund [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Me: How long does a refund take though? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Advisor: Once approved, up to 10 working days [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Me: How would it be approved? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Can that be done just through chat? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Advisor: To clarify [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]If you are ever high enough in credit where you think it warrants a refund, simply contact us via phone. webchat or email [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]If our refunds department approve your request [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Within 10 working days a refund is issued and visible in your account [/FONT]

Two weeks they're taking the P155 their email makes note of two months payments in credit. How much are they going to put the bills up in the meantime?

Scatty

wild666 wrote: »

I moved to these cowboys after they were mentioned on here. My yearly usage including gas was around 3100 and the price was so much cheaper than the monthly DD I was paying British Gas, £57 against OFTM £34, I use very little electric and virtually no gas.
After BG f*cked me over with the meter reading incurring a £260 debt minus my first months payment, of £255 I was quickly on to them, they didn't explain how they had got the reading for my smart meter, now a dumb meter, it took me 3 months to work out they had given them the reading minus the units I had used in the free time period, nearly 1900 units, and after getting it altered and me screwing up again, I didn't know the meter saved numerous readings. it was about 5 months down the line that I realised the reading was split into 3 parts, the grand total, ACT 1 & ACT 2. I decided I would email them each month with these readings and so I did and they have been using the free time readings ever since to work out my monthly bill.

We are in the same boat, you may recall. It took me AGES to sort out my ex Freetime hours. I now have to send them my reading and then a zero rate for the second bit and we're all fine and dandy. Such a palaver but I'm minded to stay now by DD is more acceptable plus they have my credit balance. Decisions...

bye_bye_band_G

If OFGEM are asking suppliers to make sure that we are never in debt throughout the year, this runs against the age old idea that you are in credit during the winter months, in debit during the summer months, and overall it evens out so that once a year your balance is zero. This principle and the idea of level Direct Debits is all the DD system has going for it.
I despair of getting my credit back from OTM. From a post above it seems as if they won't actually refund your full credit back if you have more than 2 months credit - just the EXCESS over the 2 months credit, while still insisting on the winter uplift too. So they win twice over winter. I just want my money back.
I think if many companies adopt the winter uplift for DDs it will be counter productive for the energy industry, as I forecast a lot of people will revert to payment on receipt of bill - the way we used to do it in the past. Yes we'll still have to pay more over winter but it will stop them holding our credit as well. I am certainly about to look for alternatives where I can pay on receipt of bill, I know it'll mean higher rates but at least no-one will be holding as much money of mine as they feel like in advance, with no redress for me.

wild666

orangesnaps wrote: »

This is what I got from the comments on facebook.

" So just got through to them on the phone and this is what they said. 1. They have a new system that has estimated our usage over the winter
2. They can review the DD's after 14 days, yet the DD will take effect from 10 days
3. Now this is the interesting one she let slip, their costs have gone up and they need to increase OUR DD's to make sure they cover THEIR costs over the winter period!

I will be taking my account elsewhere I am not paying more money to prop up a business that is in trouble!"

I live alone and use a hot water bottle and a flask of tea or coffee for drinks I drink about two flasks a day, 3 litres, plus the hot water bottle I spend all day on-line and surf the net. I am thinking of updating my surge protectors to ones that you can switch off each individual plug. Anything to save money, they already get £50 a month out of me and they claimed I was in debt but have been in credit by a few pounds after each £50 DD. I seriously think they are in trouble as the two in charge are either husband and wife, brother & sister or related through marriage someway.