My Dad 60 is moving back to England. Need some advice please.

bflare

OhWow wrote: »

But he doesn't need to try to lie, if he really is returning to the UK to live and can prove that.

I was thinking more about even though he is registered still he might have to re register as the doctors is 6 miles away from my house where he will be staying.


Regarding the 'harbitual test' which looks to be the main thing that he needs to satisfy it does say the following on the CAB website which could be reassuring:



Returning UK residents

The habitual residence test can also be applied to UK residents who are returning to the UK from a period spent living or working abroad. This means that there may be a delay before you are allowed to claim means-tested benefits.
However, if you are treated as a 'returning resident' you may be treated as being habitually resident as soon as you return to the UK.

skye_

bflare wrote: »

I know exactly how it works as I have EDS myself & so does my son. We have both been diagnosed & my diagnosis was from Professor Bird a rheumatologist & a was a leading specialist in EDS.



He might be 60 but he has never presented his symptoms to a doctor therefore couldn't possibly get a diagnosis.

Well if you got a diagnosis from simply going to a rheumatologist, you must be lucky. It's almost unheard of. Must be type 3..

bflare

skye_ wrote: »

Well if you got a diagnosis from simply going to a rheumatologist, you must be lucky. It's almost unheard of. Must be type 3..

I was diagnosed with a mild Classical type which is formally type II but have a lot of joint symptom overlap as found in Hypermobility type formally type III

skye_

bflare wrote: »

I was diagnosed with a mild Classical type which is formally type II but have a lot of joint symptom overlap as found in Hypermobility type formally type III

I find it astounding that you have been diagnosed with a serious genetic disease and haven’t seen a geneticist or had genetic councilling. Here, they computerise the whole family tree and your father would have been flagged up then.

Anyway, I’ll leave you to it. Hope you get him sorted

Ames

w06 wrote: »

This isn't quite right. For NHS hospital care he needs to be 'ordinarily resident' see info here https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/nhs-services/visiting-or-moving-to-england/how-to-access-nhs-services-in-england/ for gp care it's even more wooly but if he's ordinarily resident - which he will be if he's returned to live in the UK, but not if just visiting - then he'll be entitled.

Sorry, my mistake - I thought from people on here who've come from abroad and not qualified for health care that it was the HRT, especially since every time I've signed in to a hospital appointment over the last few years I've been asked how long I've lived in the country. I assume that's to flag up who needs further checks to establish residence?

silverwhistle

As pointed out to do anything in Italy you need a codice Fiscale and to have your residence registered (somewhere..).



I moved back from Italy in 2013 so in view of how matters have changed I won't comment in detail. Joining the Italian system was an issue and eventually managed it by producing evidence of employment, my private language teaching didn't suffice. It needed a fair bit of charm and reasonable Italian to accept the evidence of my temporary contract. Later I worked in public schools so the problem didn't continue to exist.



What seemed odd at the time was that it seemed easier for US citizens to join the USL for a small payment.



Returning to the UK wasn't an issue, and if there's an address for the forms he shouldn't get the third degree.

OhWow

Ames wrote: »

Sorry, my mistake - I thought from people on here who've come from abroad and not qualified for health care that it was the HRT, especially since every time I've signed in to a hospital appointment over the last few years I've been asked how long I've lived in the country. I assume that's to flag up who needs further checks to establish residence?

That's to see if they need to bill you.

Under the Immigration Act 2014 (law), it is now the carrot and stick for the NHS. If they bill you, they get to keep the money for their trust, instead of having to use their budget to pay for you. If there is no insurance to pay the bill, they can add 50% to the bill and keep that money too. They get fined if they give away healthcare to somebody who should be billed, which means they get hit twice, they get the fine and lose the money from their budget for the treatment they gave away.

British citizens are billed if they can't prove they are resident in the UK. This is why hospitals now check British citizens too, to stop NHS abuse.


Foreign nationals on UK immigration laws "visas", of more that 6 months, pay a fee up front to use the NHS now, a payment they must make it they want a visa. That fee goes to the NHS. Those on a visa of 6 months or less, now pay to use the NHS at point of use, with 50% added to the bill for no insurance. No more using the NHS bill free, because the Immigration Act 2014 ended that.

https://www.gov.uk/healthcare-immigration-application/who-needs-pay


The UK also brought in that those with NHS debt of £500 plus, are not given a visa to the UK, nor a visa to stay on the UK, until their debt is paid. That includes those wanting to visit the UK.



The NHS advise UKVI (UK Visas and Immgration) if the debt is not paid, but UKVI will also check before they issue a visa as they have been given access to NHS records and can see if they took from the NHS without paying. The visa fee is kept if the visa is refused. If they try to hide their NHS usage in their application, then they receive a 10 year ban to or from the UK, for deception.

For the other foreign nationals who can presently use the NHS bill free, the Immigration Act 2014 ended their right to bill free use of the NHS too. These are now on various agreements, which can be ended without the need for a lengthy law change. e.g. EU Free Movement.


The law also made it easier to collect the debt owed to the NHS from other EEA countries, for their citizens treatment.

OhWow

D_M_E wrote: »

Nobody has asked if he was born in the UK and thus has a UK passport which could support the ordinarily resident test.

The OP said in her opening post that he was 60 years old and born in the UK. That makes him a British citizen. The UK ended 'being born in the UK gave British citizenship' in 1983 - 35 years ago.

OhWow

bflare wrote: »

Regarding the 'harbitual test' which looks to be the main thing that he needs to satisfy it does say the following on the CAB website which could be reassuring:



Returning UK residents

The habitual residence test can also be applied to UK residents who are returning to the UK from a period spent living or working abroad. This means that there may be a delay before you are allowed to claim means-tested benefits.
However, if you are treated as a 'returning resident' you may be treated as being habitually resident as soon as you return to the UK.

That's about benefits, not the NHS. Is he looking at claiming UK benefits too?

OhWow

silverwhistle wrote: »

What seemed odd at the time was that it seemed easier for US citizens to join the USL for a small payment.

They would be under Italian immigration laws, whereas you were using the EUs free movement, which has different rules. The rules are not interchangeable. They also would have paid for a visa to be in Italy, where you got in for free under EU rules.

It's the same in the UK, UK immigration rules are different to EU rules. e.g. The EU says that EEA citizens who are not economically active in another EEA country (Students or Self Sufficients) must buy a Comprehensive Sickness Insurance policy for themself and one each for all their family members, to be using their free movement.

That CSI private insurance can be expensive, especially if they have exisitng conditions. But those on a UK immigration rules "visa" can buy the Immigration Health Surcharge for £200 a year each, which gives them access to bill free NHS, except for IVF treatment. Those using the EUs free movement and needing to buy CSIs, cannot buy the cheaper IHS from the UK.