Outfox the Market reviews: add your feedback

Merlin139

spikeyman wrote: »

Hi everyone, having had these comedians since July we have nothing but problems with switching, billing, and customer service, avoid them at all costs and do not believe the cheap energy club site either when they quote them as the cheapest. They are not and we found this out once we switched.

What they actually do is play with the membership fee each month, (daily charge) depending on the last 2 years estimates of usage for that property, not the user, they get this from a 3rd party source then estimate your usage and charge the membership fee as they like.

How many kWh's of Electricity have you been using each year?

Our initial quote, why we switched, was a fee of £7.99 a month, we are low users. What they actually charged was at first £11.99 then after that £14.01 a month when questioned they gave the reason outlined above. The charge is equivalent to a daily cost and meant we would pay around £90 a year which makes them more expensive than other quotes, so beware and do your own figures.

We received notification 2 months after we joined prices were going up and our membership charge would also increase to £15 a month £0.495 pence per day factor that in and we switched away from them as quickly as possible.

They take DD as soon as you sign up, OK fair enough but then when you look at your bills, we have 6 bills for 3 months usage with them. You cannot understand how they work them out and, even though you supply meter readings they estimate the readings as they see fit.

So far they took £269.15 from us, the bills from what we can calculate come to £151.25, they are showing a credit of only £70 in our account so where has the £47.90 gone. A complaint has been filed to ask them to supply a full statement but they do not respond so it looks like a regulator complaint will have to be made to force them to sort this out.

How many kWh's of Electricity and Gas have you used in your time with OFTM?

Take care, anyone, thinking of switching to them. Cheap energy club sent us a quote we could save money but they showed a membership fee of £6.99 which is totally untrue see here and scroll to the bottom to see the fees they say they will charge but in practice they do not. https://www.outfoxthemarket.co.uk/How-it-works.aspx

Hope that will save someone the heartache and hassle of dealing with these people, its better to pay a little bit more and get the billing and service right.

Electricity usage is what determines you Membership rate so if you use more then 2399 kWh's of Electricity each year then you will not be on the Low user rate.

I joined OFTM 23/02/18 on a Fixed rate as a Low User my quote was for 2300 kWh for Electricity and 9500 kWh for Gas. This should have put me on the LOW User membership fee but they started me on the next level. Low user being 0 to 2399 kWh per year. In the last 4 years I have averaged 2252 kWh per year.

When I noticed that I was being charged a higher membership rate I contacted them and pointed this out to them. They base the charge on something they call the Flow Rate. Having lived in my house for 16 years I have over 300 readings of my meters to back up my usage. When they checked the figures and saw that the flow rate confirmed with my figures they agreed that my membership should be reduced to the Low User rate which they backdated to the start of my time with them.

I have provided a minimum of 1 reading per month as requested and if it is submitted on the date of my bill they produce accurate bills. If its a few days before they estimate the last few days.

The best way to confirm your usage is to provide your supplier with a minimum of 1 reading per month. This will build up an accurate picture of your usage.

I would also point out that I have been able to communicate by Live chat very quickly when I have had a question. The last one being about when SMETS 2 smart meters would be available. The answer was that they are testing now and expect them to be available within 6 to 12 months. Not that I need one as I am able to monitor my energy usage now so it is of no benefit to me to get a Smart Meter.

worried_jim

Been with them since June. No issues. Website is basic but does the job, I've used live chat once with no problems. Cheapest gas and electricity I've had for a number of years and I change every year.

VoucherMan

spikeyman wrote: »

do not believe the cheap energy club site either when they quote them as the cheapest. They are not and we found this out once we switched.

I'd suggest letting MSE know of this slight error, but I've already tried that and it appears to have been completely ignored.

Merlin139 wrote: »

Electricity usage is what determines you Membership rate

No it's not. It's based on Estimated usage.
https://outfoxthemarket.co.uk/Terms-and-conditions.aspx

3.7

Under the Whack! Tariff, the unit rate element is fixed. However, membership fees may still vary depending on usage and we reserve the right to review and amend these charges where necessary. The monthly membership fee is based on your estimated annual consumption. (EAC).

Merlin139

Merlin139 wrote: »

Electricity usage is what determines you Membership rate so if you use more then 2399 kWh's of Electricity each year then you will not be on the Low user rate.

3.7 Under the Whack! Tariff, the unit rate element is fixed. However, membership fees may still vary depending on usage and we reserve the right to review and amend these charges where necessary. The monthly membership fee is based on your estimated annual consumption. (EAC). This is an industry provided figure based on a rolling two-year consumption history and this can result in your membership band being amended at any point.


Your Estimated Annual Consumption(EAC) will be effected by Electricity Usage so it will determine your membership rate!

wavelets

Organza_Lace wrote: »

So....now they have cancelled my direct debit. :mad: No explanation as to why.

It is not usually possible for any supplier to cancel a payers direct debit instruction.
(It is, of couse, possible for a supplier to fail to collect against a DDI ... but that does not cancel the DDI ... unless they fail to collect for 13 months when the DDI will then fall dormant)

Only the payer (or exceptionally the payer's bank) can normally cancel a direct debit instruction.

The exception is when a supplier indicates to the payer's bank that a collection successfully made is the final collection (e.g. if you subscribe to a 12 monthly publication, or in the case of an energy supplier, that they are aware of you having switched away and they are confident there will be no more need for another collection e.g on settlement of a final bill by DD)
That then effectively instructs the bank to cancel the DDI
It is not usual for either the supplier or the bank to notify the payer when this occurs, presumably as one would expect the payer to be aware it was to be the final payment, as per the terms of the contract they originally agreed.

I would urge you to contact your bank and ask them to clarify who, why and when your DDI was cancelled.

VoucherMan

Merlin139 wrote: »

3.7 Under the Whack! Tariff, the unit rate element is fixed. However, membership fees may still vary depending on usage and we reserve the right to review and amend these charges where necessary. The monthly membership fee is based on your estimated annual consumption. (EAC). This is an industry provided figure based on a rolling two-year consumption history and this can result in your membership band being amended at any point.


Your Estimated Annual Consumption(EAC) will be effected by Electricity Usage so it will determine your membership rate!

The thing is, dress it up any way you want, it's an estimate.

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications-and-updates/decision-estimated-annual-cost-domestic-consumers

We have decided to amend the methodology that suppliers and some price comparison sites are required to follow when estimating consumers’ annual costs. The change will allow suppliers and comparison sites to come up with their own methodologies for estimating a consumer’s annual costs,

Which of course has little relevance to Outfox as they're using these arbitrary figures for [STRIKE]screwing the customers[/STRIKE] deciding what [STRIKE]tariff[/STRIKE] monthly fee they can get away with.


Just because the figure is 'industry approved', does not in any way mean it's accurate.

• New builds won't have 2 years of history so will (possibly) be charged an average figure. For some this will be well above their actual usages.
• People moving house will inherit the previous occupants usage history, which may be much higher than theirs.
• Other factors cause people to reduce consumption, but they will still be charged based on an estimate derived from historical usage.

The last point should be emphasised. If you used 2300kWh in the last 12 months, and 2200kWh in the 12 months before that, what would you're estimated usage be now?

• 2250kWh (average)
• 2400kWh (continuing the same level of increased usage)
• 2450kWh (stick them in the next price band, there's nothing they can do about it)
• 2200kWh (it was a temporary blip and their usage will return to the lower level this year)

Maybe there is an agreed method to calculate it, but I can't find it, and the Ofgem report suggests that companies can more or less make it up as they go along.

VoucherMan

worried_jim wrote: »

Cheapest gas and electricity I've had for a number of years and I change every year.

And for most they still are, although I think I've seen comments that they're no longer the cheapest for some. But because of their pricing structure there's no guarantee they'll still be the cheapest in months to come. They've already had to back down once after a backlash when they tried to increase the monthly fees. It wouldn't surprise me if they're fervently searching for some other loophole they can use to increase the price.


The issue for me has been that it's not a fixed price as advertised. The price is still good in comparison, and kudos to the person who came up with the devious idea, but I'd prefer to be with a supplier who's open and honest about their pricing, even if it means paying a few pounds more.

Hazzanet

wavelets wrote: »

It is not usually possible for any supplier to cancel a payers direct debit instruction.
(It is, of couse, possible for a supplier to fail to collect against a DDI ... but that does not cancel the DDI ... unless they fail to collect for 13 months when the DDI will then fall dormant)

It is possible for a supplier to cancel the DDI using either a 19 transaction code with the final payment (as you note) and they also have the option to send an 0C transaction code without any payment to cancel down the DDI.

It's possible that this is human error and someone has clicked something that has sent an 0C code down on your account. As Wavelets says, best ask the bank to find out whether it was OTM that cancelled it their end.

martyp

Just wanted to add so far so good having gone to OFTM. Gas switched in August but electricity switched in September as it was in the Iresa to Octopus transition. A couple of minor bugs in the online portal with DD not showing and error page on usage but it was set up and working quickly and everything seems to be up to date in there. Have made a few queries via the chat and e-mail and had responses on e-mail generally about a day later and charges seem to be correct although haven't over-analysed they're definitely cheap. I have been notified already of a price rise from 1st November of 7% which is about £36 a year for me but still cheaper than all the other tariffs out there so happy to take the risk on the variable tariff as if no more significant increases especially over winter it could still work out cheaper than a fixed tariff possibly overall.

dont_use_vistaprint

Hengus wrote: »

I am really not sure why this practice causes so much concern? Energy suppliers have to pay their wholesale suppliers in advance of supply. Looking at my bank account, I currently pay for my house insurance; TV Licence; mobile phone; Sky TV; car insurance in advance of supply, so why not energy? The benefit to the consumer is that the supplier does not have to borrow so much and should be able to offer lower prices as a result.

You generally pay fixed / contracted service fees in advance and additional / usage in arrears. That's how insurance , tv and telecoms works.

How can you recognise revenue that's based on metered usage, its unacceptable.