Brexit, the economy and house prices part 5

Thrugelmir

gfplux wrote: »

As beautiful as Latvia is bringing it into the conversation is scraping the barrel.

You are a committed European. Yet care little for a fellow member state. Whose population is declining for economic reasons. Likewise from afar you continually lecture us that still live in the UK to accept these people with open arms. Provide housing, schools, doctors, treatment through the NHS at a moments notice. That's a very self centred narrow point of view. Totally ignoring the very real damage that's being done to swathes of forgotten rust belt Europe.

gfplux

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

But remaining would almost certainly have changed it.

It has been stated by the eu that all members will have to join the euro by 2020.

So we would have either had to join or we would be placed outside of the main eu countries. So we would either have had to submit to economic ruin at the hands of the idiots in the eu or be kicked out in all but name anyway.

Personally I prefer to control the rudder of the ship I sail.

I can not let that mis statement just pass by as it is not correct.
There have been many statements about the EU by various EU officials.
However there was NO 2020 deadline for any member (Britain) to adopt the Euro.
What has been said is that any NEW member would be EXPECTED to join the Euro.
There have been too many wrong facts on both sides of the argument. This is one of them.

gfplux

Thrugelmir wrote: »

You are a committed European. Yet care little for a fellow member state. Whose population is declining for economic reasons. Likewise from afar you continually lecture us that still live in the UK to accept these people with open arms. Provide housing, schools, doctors, treatment through the NHS at a moments notice. That's a very self centred narrow point of view. Totally ignoring the very real damage that's being done to swathes of forgotten rust belt Europe.

Oh please Thrugelmir, Lecturing from afar, while a nicely crafted phrase subconsciously shows how small distances appear to you.
Turn the telescope around, look through the correct end and see that all your close neighbours are important trade partners.

Looking for reasons to disqualify people from having an opinion suggests where your political loyalties lie.

cogito

Thrugelmir wrote: »

You are a committed European. Yet care little for a fellow member state. Whose population is declining for economic reasons. Likewise from afar you continually lecture us that still live in the UK to accept these people with open arms. Provide housing, schools, doctors, treatment through the NHS at a moments notice. That's a very self centred narrow point of view. Totally ignoring the very real damage that's being done to swathes of forgotten rust belt Europe.

I've been making this very same point many times on here over the last couple of years. This is the very real damage that is being done by FoM. However, for the EU, this is something that they insist upon with the fervour of unthinking religious zealots. The alternative of encouraging the economic development of these countries to give their youngest and brightest incentive to stay does not seem to occur to them.

The way in which populations are declining in almost every EU member east of Berlin is frightening. The way it's going in Bulgaria, they may as well hand it back to Turkey.

https://qz.com/1187819/country-ranking-worlds-fastest-shrinking-countries-are-in-eastern-europe/

kabayiri

cogito wrote: »

I've been making this very same point many times on here over the last couple of years. This is the very real damage that is being done by FoM. However, for the EU, this is something that they insist upon with the fervour of unthinking religious zealots. The alternative of encouraging the economic development of these countries to give their youngest and brightest incentive to stay does not seem to occur to them.

The way in which populations are declining in almost every EU member east of Berlin is frightening. The way it's going in Bulgaria, they may as well hand it back to Turkey.

https://qz.com/1187819/country-ranking-worlds-fastest-shrinking-countries-are-in-eastern-europe/

The article makes a good point.

FOM, by definition, doesn't have a direction of flow defined.

Why shouldn't these countries accept large numbers of migrants to bolster falling populations? Many of these countries are advocates of the Freedom of Movement concept anyway.

vivatifosi

That's an interesting article, thanks cogito.

It lists three reasons for the falling population: falling births, increased mortality and net migration.

I found the latter interesting. All the countries mentioned were in Eastern Europe, but some were not in the EU: Bosnia, Ukraine and Moldova for example. I wonder where their net migration goes to.

kabayiri

Does anyone know if we could rescind Article 50 at any point up until the official leave date, or would we need to go through Article 49?

Does cancellation of A50 require agreement amongst all member states?

vivatifosi

I think they would allow us back Kab. The EU would then be virtually impossible to leave... If big UK can't hack it, what hope is there for a Sweden or Netherlands. Plus of course they won't have a revenue hole to fill.

I also think there would be a sting in the tail. We wouldn't have to join the Euro, but we'd have to forego the rebate for example. Purely hypothetical on my part of course.

cogito

kabayiri wrote: »

The article makes a good point.

FOM, by definition, doesn't have a direction of flow defined.

Why shouldn't these countries accept large numbers of migrants to bolster falling populations? Many of these countries are advocates of the Freedom of Movement concept anyway.

Because they would be the 'wrong kind' of migrants.

Just wait for the outcome of the forthcoming Hungarian elections where the two main parties, Fidesz and JOBBIK, will between them have a two thirds majority which will enable them to amend the constitution so that only Hungary will have the right to decide who can live there. They will do it which will put them directly on a collision course with Brussels.

kabayiri

vivatifosi wrote: »

...
I also think there would be a sting in the tail. We wouldn't have to join the Euro, but we'd have to forego the rebate for example. Purely hypothetical on my part of course.

I was thinking more along the lines of the Gibraltar issue. Spain has had a bit of poor PR of late with the Catalan issue. Wouldn't this be an opportunity for their politicians to spin up some good news?