Brexit, the economy and house prices part 5

Thrugelmir

gfplux wrote: »

that will change Britain, the economy and social cohesion for the worse for a lifetime.

The social cohesion is already under pressure. Knives, guns, drugs , people trafficking, prostitution. Welcome to open border UK. It's very real and extremely serious.

BobQ

Some fine words which she could have said a year ago. A U turn of sorts but the question remains can this cherry picking charter be achieved in practice.

If the EU wants to solve the British problem this is an olive branch, but if the EU stick to their guns then nothing will have changed.

Thrugelmir

BobQ wrote: »

but if the EU stick to their guns then nothing will have changed.

Then never was ever going to be a negotiation. What a waste of time and resource for all taxpayers across Europe. Welcome to inefficient Brussels bureaucracy. Hardly an endorsement for being a member of the club.

BobQ

ukcarper wrote: »

Listening to some people on here I wonder if they actually listened to speech, they seem to be hearing what they want to hear.

Most difficult political speeches are just that. If this keeps the majority of Brexiteers and Remainers content because they each think that May is agreeing with them then the peace will be short lived.

If this is a genuine U-turn to advocate a soft Brexit, I hope it works but fear it will not.

Filo25

Rough_Justice wrote: »

No.
Nice try at putting your own spin on things but no.
What I AM happy at is the EU being shown to be the intransigent, coercive, despotic, protectionist bunch of money-grabbing specimens that so many knew them to be.

So what about the USA?
If the EU want to turn it into a trade war over (basically) cheap Chinese steel that's another example of the above.

"Actually" .. yup & I'm willing to lay you odds on that those asking for more detail are all Europhiles.
I mean really, how much detail do you want?
That's what the negotiators are for.
If you want to talk about the nitty-gritty of quotas on bratwurst vs Cornish pasties or similar feel free, but expecting May (or any senior negotiator) to discuss such frippery is ridiculous.

You're just worried, aren't you?
That Brexit will not lead to the BRINO you want and thought you would get.

The main country affected by tariffs is Canada, China isn't even in the top 10, but if you want to think brave Trump is fighting a battle against Chinese dumping, fill your boots.

Why the hell would I be worried beyond thinking we are sleepwalking through negotiations and still don't seem to realistically know what we want, still nothing to resolve the NI border. .... unsurprisingly.

ukcarper

BobQ wrote: »

Most difficult political speeches are just that. If this keeps the majority of Brexiteers and Remainers content because they each think that May is agreeing with them then the peace will be short lived.

If this is a genuine U-turn to advocate a soft Brexit, I hope it works but fear it will not.

If we do not have to accept FOM, can negotiate our own trade deals and agree to take into account EU rules where in effects our dealings with them I dont see it as a genuine U-turn to a soft brexit. Im not convince she will be able to deliver that though.

Filo25

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Then never was ever going to be a negotiation. What a waste of time and resource for all taxpayers across Europe. Welcome to inefficient Brussels bureaucracy. Hardly an endorsement for being a member of the club.

Don't worry we've got them over a barrel, right where we want them, they'll be begging us for a deal because Prosecco and stuff.

Sorry I thought I was 2 years ago there for a minute.

We haven't even decided which base model we want to operate from, in terms of what we are offering a Canada style deal seems to be the best on the table (Although still doesn't resolve the NI border question), if we want more we have to offer more which is currently ruled out by our self imposed redlines.

The sad fact is we still haven't gotten close enough to the EU position to even begin a meaningful negotiation, and to begin exploiting differences between EU nations,to get a better deal, because we are still convinced that the EU somehow owes us a much better deal than anyone else.

Filo25

ukcarper wrote: »

If we do not have to accept FOM, can negotiate our own trade deals and agree to take into account EU rules where in effects our dealings with them I dont see it as a genuine U-turn to a soft brexit. Im not convince she will be able to deliver that though.

I almost feel sorry for her to an extent, I don't see what she can deliver that is acceptable to both wings of her party and the EU at present, you can probably keep 2 of those 3 parties happy relatively easily, but all 3 is tough unless opinions can be softened somewhat in the coming months.

ukcarper

Filo25 wrote: »

I almost feel sorry for her to an extent, I don't see what she can deliver that is acceptable to both wings of her party and the EU at present, you can probably keep 2 of those 3 parties happy relatively easily, but all 3 is tough unless opinions can be softened somewhat in the coming months.

I don’t think it would be a easy job for anybody bearing in mind you have to respect the referendum result. I certainly dont see Corbyn doing any better.

Arklight

Rough_Justice wrote: »

No.
Nice try at putting your own spin on things but no.
What I AM happy at is the EU being shown to be the intransigent, coercive, despotic, protectionist bunch of money-grabbing specimens that so many knew them to be.

So what about the USA?
If the EU want to turn it into a trade war over (basically) cheap Chinese steel that's another example of the above.

"Actually" .. yup & I'm willing to lay you odds on that those asking for more detail are all Europhiles.
I mean really, how much detail do you want?
That's what the negotiators are for.
If you want to talk about the nitty-gritty of quotas on bratwurst vs Cornish pasties or similar feel free, but expecting May (or any senior negotiator) to discuss such frippery is ridiculous.

You're just worried, aren't you?
That Brexit will not lead to the BRINO you want and thought you would get.

Doesn’t seem to put you off voting for the Tories though does it?

By the way it’s the USA that are starting the trade war. Donald Trump says they are easy to win. For the USA.

With which side are we meant to line up with there?