Brexit, the economy and house prices part 5

mrginge

Herzlos wrote: »

Yes. You've been lied to about everything else, why not movement too?

You're not getting rid of immigration.

You seem to be unable to grasp the concept that being against FoM is not the same as being against immigration.

tracey3596

Strange that there has been no mention either here or in our media of the European Council today moving towards their establishing a so-called "defence union".
I wonder why?
:whistle:

The Permanent Structured Cooperation (Pesco), first set out in the Lisbon Treaty, will allow members states to jointly develop military capabilities, invest in shared projects and enhance their respective armed forces.

http://cyprus-mail.com/2017/12/11/eu-moves-closer-defence-union/

As Juncker said,

“I welcome the operational steps taken today by Member States to lay the foundations of a European #DefenceUnion. Our security cannot be outsourced.”

I know the following is now a little out-of-date but does this mean that the NATO troops stationed as below will soon not be needed?
It could save NATO a fortune and allow their resources to be used elsewhere.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-nato-border-forces-map-where-are-they-positioned-a7562391.html

ukcarper

Herzlos wrote: »

Yes. You've been lied to about everything else, why not movement too?

You're not getting rid of immigration.

Hardly anybody thought we were getting rid of immigration as it’s the brexiters that are suppose to be uneducated fools, I would have though you would understand the difference between controlled immigration and no immigration.

System

I'm relieved to discover that there's no brexiters that hope for no deal.

Especially all the ones that say they do.

Good news, Rinoa will be pleased. And the countless others.

OUT MEANS OUT *froth*

kabayiri

phillw wrote: »

...
And yet it's immigration that is the main reason we want to shut ourselves off from the rest of the world, while they are welcoming refugees. Maybe your opinion of the EU is totally flawed?

It's change and the consequences of change.

I honestly think that some people can cope with a rate of change, and beyond that, they really struggle.

We have decades of moderate migration into the UK, and for the most part it didn't really bother most.

The pace of change has really accelerated in the last decade and a half though.

It's not just here. Talking to people in the Polish office they are also less than keen about having to accept incomers there. Are they xenophobic as well? Or does it take time to accept change.

Rough_Justice

Here's an interesting one.
Hot on the heels of the Catalonian debacle comes this today:

Corsican nationalists have demanded talks with the French government over more autonomy after a convincing win in Sunday’s regional elections.

President Emmanuel Macron now faces the dilemma of whether to loosen France’s grip on the Mediterranean island or to maintain centralised control.

Like Catalonia, whose bid for independence from Spain has sparked a crisis with Madrid and in the European Union, Corsica has long harboured separatist ambitions.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/11/macron-corsica-dilemma-nationalists-election-gains-france
There is increasing much nationalism in the EU which suggests that many see the increased federalism of Juncker, Schulz and others as unwanted.

Rinoa

Once again we hear today from TM: "Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed."

Just in case there are any remainers still in doubt she continued:

"This offer is on the table in the context of us agreeing the partnership for the future, agreeing the next stage and agreeing the partnership for the future.

"If we don't agree that partnership then this offer is off the table."

Hope that helps.

buglawton

Rough_Justice wrote: »

Here's an interesting one.
Hot on the heels of the Catalonian debacle comes this today:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/11/macron-corsica-dilemma-nationalists-election-gains-france
There is increasing much nationalism in the EU which suggests that many see the increased federalism of Juncker, Schulz and others as unwanted.

Mind you, both Scotland and Catalonia imagine themselves as instant EU and Euro members if they could be independent of their current countries.

Herzlos

ukcarper wrote: »

Hardly anybody thought we were getting rid of immigration as it’s the brexiters that are suppose to be uneducated fools, I would have though you would understand the difference between controlled immigration and no immigration.

We don't control it now, why will we control it later?

It's very naive to assume we'll go full WTO just to avoid fom, so we'll have fom if the eu tells us so. It's also the only way to satisfy both the DUP and good Friday agreement.

ukcarper

Herzlos wrote: »

We don't control it now, why will we control it later?

It's very naive to assume we'll go full WTO just to avoid fom, so we'll have fom if the eu tells us so. It's also the only way to satisfy both the DUP and good Friday agreement.

I think if there is no other way we will. By the way that is not what I want.