Brexit, the economy and house prices (Part 3)

Thrugelmir

Herzlos wrote: »

Are you talking about the EU or the Tories?

Who is the EU? Certainly not the people. In essence an unelected elite.

A_Medium_Size_Jock

cogito wrote: »

gfplux wrote: »

I don't disagree with any of that but if you look at current polls, Merkel is on 36% and Schultz on 35%. No way will these go into coalition together. CDU'S old partners are on 7% as are the Greens so with those two, Merkel would scramble 50%. AfD are on 10.5% at present.

All this perhaps helps to explain why Merkel is refusing to speak to May at present.

And yet when I explain to sceptics here that all is not rosy in Germany I am roundly berated by some.
Well, here is more evidence of differing opinions inside Germany too from Sky News today:

Angela Merkel has been booed and heckled on the election trail by voters angry at her open door policy on immigration.

http://news.sky.com/story/angela-merkel-heckled-on-campaign-trail-as-she-seeks-fourth-term-as-german-chancellor-11015726

Yes, yes, yes, the probability is that Frau Merkel will still win.
No, this does not mean the collapse of the EU is imminent.
It does however yet again show that despite what some pro-EU protagonists would have you believe, there is considerable dissatisfaction of one sort or another across this supposedly "united" Europe.

Herzlos

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Who is the EU? Certainly not the people. In essence an unelected elite.

Name me someone in the EU that isn't elected or appointed by someone elected?

How does that compare to UK Lords or media barons?

Thrugelmir

Originally Posted by Arklight
Good to see that between them the Brussels negotiators and Merkel and Macron, have given the UK's Brexit team the spanking it deserves.

This Macron? As popular as Trump. :whistle:

Emmanuel Macron's approval rating is taking a massive nosedive

French President Emmanuel Macron's popularity among the country's voters is sinking to near-record-low levels a few months after his election win, according to a new Harris Poll.

Only 37% of voters approve of the job Macron is doing, down from a high of 57% after his election in May. Macron, a pro-business centrist — who was elected in a landslide over Marine Le Pen, a far-right nationalist, 66% to 34% — has since come under fire for his domestic agenda.

Though Macron made a strong debut on the international stage, hosting President Donald Trump in Paris, he's now seeking to loosen France's employment standards, making it easier for companies to fire workers, The Wall Street Journal reported. And that could prime powerful unions, along with students and retirees, to protest his proposed reforms.

He could be facing an "alliance of the aggrieved" when he plans to roll out his plans in September, one union official told The Journal.

Macron's election win may have been boosted, however, by exceptionally low turnout: Over one-third of voters didn't vote for either candidate.

Macron's low approval rating has company across the Atlantic Ocean: Trump's is sitting at 37%, according to a recent ABC News/ Washington Post poll.

This Merkel?

Merkel on the ROCKS: German leader plummets in latest election poll on return from holiday

Makes Mrs May appear very popular.

kabayiri

Here's a guess. I reckon that if they broke down that EU bill the UK are being asked to pay to a detail level, it would just expose the really bad spending commitments made.

Apparently, we have a 1bn Euro share related to the EU foreign aid budget. What?!! I mean...its not as if the UK is already committed to £13bn+ of foreign aid ourselves. It reminds me of how the European car makers used to refer to UK ... "treasure island"

Thrugelmir

Herzlos wrote: »

Name me someone in the EU that isn't elected or appointed by someone elected?

You were comparing the EU to the Tories though. I can express my opinion at the ballot box regarding the Tories. The EU can dictate and I have no voice.

There's no HoL monitoring the EU and holding it to account. Media barons no longer control the news in the era of internet social media. Arguably a pop star or band has equally as much influence over a section of society. Money has always talked when it comes to politics. That's a fact of life. As Gina Miller herself proved.

sann420

From past experience we can safely say that anything that comes out of Theresa's mouth cannot be trusted. I am still astonished that we have a person with such bad judgement as still our PM.

So even though right now she is taking Britain towards a very Hard brexit; I think at some point the Tories will declare another referendum on the "final" deal with the EU.

Whats your opinion?

holidaysforme

The whole thing is beyond embarrassing. We're an utter laughing stock.:mad:

I was listening to a Tory mp on tv last week. She said there were a lot if mp's who voted Brexit in her own party who knew Brexiti was going to be a disaster, but were too afraid to say so in public because of the backlash.

Rusty_Shackleton

Thrugelmir wrote: »

You were comparing the EU to the Tories though. I can express my opinion at the ballot box regarding the Tories. The EU can dictate and I have no voice.

There's no HoL monitoring the EU and holding it to account. .

I dont understand your position: you want democratic accountability, but then talk about the unelected HoL in a positive way? As for expressing your opinion at the ballot box... With the EU you elect your MEP, and each countrys elected government represents national interests in the commission, each countrys finance ministers also meet. Its simply false to say that you don't have a voice, you have several (which is more than the one you elect, your MP, in the UK).

Do you actually mean that you feel your opinion through the ballot box is 'diluted' because of the scale and varying interests within the EU? Because I can understand that some might not like that in the EU there is inevitably more compromise because there are such different national voices, often with competing interests... To me thats acceptable because we get to influence others we otherwise wouldn't get to.. Thats an opinion, each to their own, but to claim you have no representation?!

Can you give an example of being dictated to by the EU that wouldn't alsp apply to the UK government? I mean we all cede some sovereignty to the UK government when we could have more decisions taken locally, but last time I checked the likes of the Yorkshire Party and the Cornish independence lot have never done well... Why is an English region pooling sovereignty any different than the UK doing so with the EU?

Thrugelmir

The elastic has snapped. Time to move on.

More embarrassing is the fact that some people seem to take enjoyment in running thir own country down......... Sad sad state of affairs.