Land Registry questions

Wemmick

Hi, we are purchasing a property which has a piece of unregistered land inside the front gate. Our sellers' solicitors submitted an application to land registry, which was expedited. It went out to consultation and the neighbour has raised an objection. (There is an adjoining piece of land used by the neighbour which is also unregistered, but which we are not claiming, and it is unclear whether this was mistakenly included in the original application.) Faced with a wall of silence, and with no direct access to the details of the application, how long can we now expect this to take, and what are the further stages involved?

cprince317

Hi Land Registry

We're close to completing on a leashold house and the contracts have come through showing, to our surprise, that someone whose name we don't know is actually the named "Tenant" in the Lease contract with the council, and that the lease is for both our own property and the one next door, so it seems our neighbour has our lease. It's down to 76 years remaining on the lease so we were planning to extend the lease as soon as possible - but if it actually belongs to our neighbour does this mean we are at his mercy and he can just run the lease right down?

What are our options - is it possible to separate our properties so they are under two leases? I'm sure he won't want us to buy the whole lease from him. If the lease runs down our property will be valueless and we need to consider whether we need to pull out.

Yours, panicked of north east england

Debbie1980

Hi Land Registry

I hope you can help with this question.

We are looking to buy a house which has been using a section of land owned by the local council. The previous owners have also been using the land. It has been fenced off. There are declarations from the current owners and previous owners stating continuous use for 20 years. We had been of the understanding that if adverse possession is applied for, then Land Registry will contact the current owner (Council) and they can object. However the current house owner believes that due to the length of time it has been used for, it can be transferred without approaching the council. Can the land be transferred without contacting the council? We are worried as they want to complete and we then deal with taking possession of the house after we take ownership, as they believe there won’t be a problem with doing it, just a timescale.

Thank you

Edit: as they have declarations from the previous owners dating from the late 80’s, we are being told that a claim for adverse possession can be made under the pre-2003 rules and that this means the current owner does not need to be notified. As they can show continuous use from the 80’s they are saying Land Registry will just sign it over at the cost of approx £200 fee. Is this correct?

flyer

Hi Land Registry

I am currently buying the leasehold of a flat and my solicitor wants to charge me £100 for "Land Registry Registration Fee". Can I not do this myself?

Tiglet2

Debbie1980 I am sure Land Registry will advise you, but in the meantime here are my thoughts (I'm a conveyancing assistant).

No, the current owner cannot apply to get this land transferred without notifying the council. The owner would have to submit transfer documents to Land Registry which would require the Council's signature on the legal Transfer. Land Registry will not action a Transfer of land without the current owner's agreement. Councils do not usually agree to sell land in any case, particularly if there are any rights over it for access or service cables within the land.

I doubt your solicitor will agree to complete without the agreement of both parties on how you wish to proceed. This is your decision, not the vendor's. Your choices are:

1. Buy the property knowing the land belongs to the Council, or don't. You could probably carry on using the land as the current owner does, but be aware that it is not yours and you won't be able to build on it.
2. Decide whether or not to accept the boundary as is or insist the owner moves it to where it should be and ask for the reduction in purchase price (since the EA may have valued it lower if they knew it didn't come with this additional land).
3. Insist the vendor applies for adverse possession. This will delay the process by at least a month with no guarantee of success.

babyblade41

Tiglet2 wrote: »

Debbie1980 I am sure Land Registry will advise you, but in the meantime here are my thoughts (I'm a conveyancing assistant).

No, the current owner cannot apply to get this land transferred without notifying the council. The owner would have to submit transfer documents to Land Registry which would require the Council's signature on the legal Transfer. Land Registry will not action a Transfer of land without the current owner's agreement. Councils do not usually agree to sell land in any case, particularly if there are any rights over it for access or service cables within the land.

I doubt your solicitor will agree to complete without the agreement of both parties on how you wish to proceed. This is your decision, not the vendor's. Your choices are:

1. Buy the property knowing the land belongs to the Council, or don't. You could probably carry on using the land as the current owner does, but be aware that it is not yours and you won't be able to build on it.
2. Decide whether or not to accept the boundary as is or insist the owner moves it to where it should be and ask for the reduction in purchase price (since the EA may have valued it lower if they knew it didn't come with this additional land).
3. Insist the vendor applies for adverse possession. This will delay the process by at least a month with no guarantee of success.

been through this recently. An application will have to go to land registry and hopefully if the vendors agree to go for adverse possession the submitting solicitor can ask to expedite it . They will look at it within 10 days.
All the paperwork has to be in order to go to the next stage which invariably will require a site visit.
If expedited this again can be done in 10 days but still the case worker has to wait for the report from the site visit and go through it.
The next stage is notifying the owner if known or surrounding properties it. affects . As you know the council owns it , it would be very doubtful if they agree to a sale

If a successful adverse possession could be gained then it would come with possessory title but I believe can be upgraded to title absolute after 12 years

Sally_Forth

flyer wrote: »

Hi Land Registry

I am currently buying the leasehold of a flat and my solicitor wants to charge me £100 for "Land Registry Registration Fee". Can I not do this myself?

You could, but you would have to consider the cost savings.
The fee charged by LR would double if the application is not submitted electronically, most solicitors submit electronically.
For instance, if your leasehold was between £100,001 - £200,000 the solicitors fee would most likely be £40, to you it would be £80.
You would also need to supply identity evidence, you could either visit a LR office if you can get to one easily (no idea if they charge for this) or get a solicitor to complete an ID1 form for you. The only price I've seen online for this is £85+VAT.

You may not save as much as you think by submitting it yourself.

Land_Registry

Wemmick wrote: »

Hi, we are purchasing a property which has a piece of unregistered land inside the front gate. Our sellers' solicitors submitted an application to land registry, which was expedited. It went out to consultation and the neighbour has raised an objection. (There is an adjoining piece of land used by the neighbour which is also unregistered, but which we are not claiming, and it is unclear whether this was mistakenly included in the original application.) Faced with a wall of silence, and with no direct access to the details of the application, how long can we now expect this to take, and what are the further stages involved?

Our Practice Guide explains the procedures when an objection is made and what happens next.

Your seller's solicitor should be keeping you informed but these things can take time to resolve as much depends on how far those involved wish to take such matters before they are resolved

Land_Registry

cprince317 wrote: »

Hi Land Registry

We're close to completing on a leashold house and the contracts have come through showing, to our surprise, that someone whose name we don't know is actually the named "Tenant" in the Lease contract with the council, and that the lease is for both our own property and the one next door, so it seems our neighbour has our lease. It's down to 76 years remaining on the lease so we were planning to extend the lease as soon as possible - but if it actually belongs to our neighbour does this mean we are at his mercy and he can just run the lease right down?

What are our options - is it possible to separate our properties so they are under two leases? I'm sure he won't want us to buy the whole lease from him. If the lease runs down our property will be valueless and we need to consider whether we need to pull out.

Yours, panicked of north east england

You need to rely on your legal advice here to consider your options. I don't really follow who owns what or what you are buying as you refer to a tenant in the lease contract with the council?

The length of the lease being bought is the key factor I suspect and presumably you are looking to get some guarantees over lengthening it before you purchase

All things we can't advise you on as we register the outcomes. It's your conveyancer who needs to advise you

Land_Registry

flyer wrote: »

Hi Land Registry

I am currently buying the leasehold of a flat and my solicitor wants to charge me £100 for "Land Registry Registration Fee". Can I not do this myself?

You can but the land registration fee is payable whether you use a solicitor or not. The solicitor's fee woukd be more than £100
Our online guidance deals with the registration aspects