Dismissal for gross misconduct- advice needed

jobbingmusician

And, it goes without saying, include in your appeal an offer to repay the £3200 (maybe in monthly instalments direct from salary).

lincroft1710

jobbingmusician wrote: »

And, it goes without saying, include in your appeal an offer to repay the £3200 (maybe in monthly instalments direct from salary).

OP has only worked there for 7 months, he/she can be dismissed without reason.

daytona0

MEM62 wrote: »

I do no think that your employer has acted incorrectly and I think that spending over three grand of their money on your personal phone calls can legitimately be considered gross misconduct. However, the judgement is harsh.

I would appeal, explain that you had no idea that this would incur a financial burden for the company and offer to reimburse their costs. No guarantee that you will be successful but you have little to loose.

Aye, that makes some sense!

If the company are really that bothered about the money then they would have little problem taking X amount a month directly from OP's wage packet to cover the debt AND they can monitor future use of the phones safe in the knowledge that it is crystal clear to OP that future transgressions WILL be gross misconduct.

That, of course, assumes that they don't have another reason for wanting OP out, or if they don't like OP in general.

prowla

What is the company's policy re. personal calls?

theoretica

lincroft1710 wrote: »

OP has only worked there for 7 months, he/she can be dismissed without reason.

Indeed, the OP can be dismissed without reason. But they are being dismissed for gross misconduct, which is different. If the appeal succeeds in changing the reason for dismissal from 'gross misconduct' it would be an improvement on the CV.

Undervalued

theoretica wrote: »

Indeed, the OP can be dismissed without reason. But they are being dismissed for gross misconduct, which is different. If the appeal succeeds in changing the reason for dismissal from 'gross misconduct' it would be an improvement on the CV.

Yes and no.

There is no obligation (with a very few exceptions) to provide a reference at all and realistically there is little difference between a refusal and a "bad" reference.

The most immediate difference is, if it is not gross misconduct, then the OP is entitled to a week's notice (or more depending on his contract).

He could in theory make a claim for wrongful dismissal in an attempt to clarify this point as there is no qualifying period for such a claim. However, unless he is was very well paid that is unlikely to be cost effective. A tribunal cannot order a decent reference or one at all. Winning such a claim would, I suspect, reduce the chances of a worthwhile reference to zero. Maybe, just maybe, file a claim and withdraw it in exchange for a COT 3 agreement for a satisfactory reference?

Realistically very, very few internal appeals are upheld and there is little reason to think this one will be. As somebody else said "harsh but fair" and harsh is not unlawful.

Learn the lesson and move on would be my advice.

ThemeOne

daytona0 wrote: »

That, of course, assumes that they don't have another reason for wanting OP out, or if they don't like OP in general.

I suspect this is the root of the issue. I've asked the OP a few times if they have been shown the bills for the alleged financial loss.

If no bills have been produced, the whole financial loss may be a fabrication - the employer may simply think it sounds better than saying "bye, we didn't like you", even though within the first two years you can be got rid of on pretty much any pretext.

[Deleted User]

VOIP doesn't instantly mean all calls are free. It might be free for the company to phone another branch of the same company (anywhere in the world) VOIP to VOIP. Calling from VOIP to a standard phone line here or aboard could and probably will occur some costs somewhere down the line no pun intended.

Also offering to pay it all back isn't going to get you off the hook, you stole from the company, it's no different from going home with a bag full supplies from the stationary cupboard, but offering to pay for them when you are caught leaving the building with them. You still intended to steal them.

stugib

Deleted_User wrote: »

Also offering to pay it all back isn't going to get you off the hook, you stole from the company, it's no different from going home with a bag full supplies from the stationary cupboard, but offering to pay for them when you are caught leaving the building with them. You still intended to steal them.

Where was the OPs intent?

[Deleted User]

stugib wrote: »

Where was the OPs intent?

Well who really thinks phone calls are free just because you don't pay for them, the company does.