Dismissal for gross misconduct- advice needed

Ozzuk

daytona0 wrote: »

How does voip work like?

I can 'ring' someone in Australia using an app and that's free to do, much like whatsapp I imagine? (you can do it on FB).

But how would it work with a company? Do they pay the voip provider per connected call? Or set fee?

.

I'm aware of two scenarios, one is you configure VoIP to use a WAN link between international sites - the call is free as it stays internal and uses the internet link. If dialling a private number in a different country you can also configure VoIP to 'breakout' at the international site after routing over the WAN, this means it effectively becomes a local call.

I should add, you can of course use applications like SKYPE/OCS/Webex.

bouicca21

Somehow I doubt the use of the personal mobile saved the company as much as 3 grand.

DCFC79

The fact it was a big international company changes nothing, you used the phone for calls you shouodnt have done.

Would you mind if I made calls on your landline/ mobile that cost you money ?

Undervalued

Simpleton1 wrote: »

I saved them money on the mobile bill for which we receive bills every month. My job required some travel and remote working hence the use of mobiles. The alleged misuse is on the landline.
It was my seventh month working there.

Irrelevant. Even if you are "donating" calls made on your personal mobile it doesn't give you the right to take something else in exchange without permission. That would be like saying "because I donate £1000 a year to Oxfam I can go into their shops and help myself to up to £1000 worth of goods!

Also, what, if anything, the firm paid for the calls is also irrelevant in so far as you helping yourself to them without permission. The fact that they may have got something for free doesn't give you the right to take it.

What they paid has some relevance in calculating how much you need to pay back but that is all.

Ronaldo_Mconaldo

This is a wind up, nobody would be this much of a simpleton.

Undervalued

Ronaldo_Mconaldo wrote: »

This is a wind up, nobody would be this much of a simpleton.

It may be but, sadly, I have seen first hand a very similar situation. That was a fairly senior academic, about fifteen years ago when all call were bought individually and logged on itemised bills. The total was nearer £6K in that case as he spent hours most days talking to family in Australia!

sangie595

Undervalued wrote: »

It may be but, sadly, I have seen first hand a very similar situation. That was a fairly senior academic, about fifteen years ago when all call were bought individually and logged on itemised bills. The total was nearer £6K in that case as he spent hours most days talking to family in Australia!

Yes, unfortunately I have also seen cases that are similar. For some strange reason people who know that they get itemized phone bills at home never seem to consider the fact that employers do too! We have even had cases of employers withdrawing personal use of work phones altogether because some idiot interpreted "short personal calls of an important nature" to mean three hours, twice a week, to the other side of the globe!

And before anyone asks, yes, there are individual phone records of employees calls. We have sometimes asked employers for disclosure of them to support defence arguments. Many employers have even been able to track incoming calls to individual numbers for years. And of course that is all so much easier now. I once successfully defended a member charged with bullying employees (it was a management stitch up) by using incoming and outgoing phone records alone, because they proved the employees were lying.

Simpleton1

sangie595 wrote: »

I do think you are missing a valuable lesson for future employment here. There was no "alleged misuse". It was "actual misuse".

Yes sorry, actual misuse.

MEM62

Simpleton1 wrote: »

Hi. I found out today that I have been dismissed for gross misconduct. The allegation is that I made private international calls which has incurred the company £3200 worth of costs over a 3 month period. I had not known about the costs to the company and this was dropped as a bombshell on me. Why would you know? You didn't negotiate your company's telecom contract. I have made international costs at previous employers before and as far as I understood voip calls are all inclusive and do not incur incremental costs. As above how would you know? You are not aware of the terms of the agreement and what is chargeable and what isn't. The organisation is also a large worldwide business and so I was under the impression that this would be case here too. A dangerous assumption as it turned out.
I explained at the disciplinary hearing that if I had known about the costs being incurred by the bank, I could have easily used whatsapp to make the calls. The reason why I didnt was because landline call offered better connectivity.
I have been very upfront and honest during the investigation process and caused no trouble at all despite some of the information provided being incorrect. As you should be.
My question is whether using company phone to make calls is something that can be construed as "gross misconduct"? I have not stolen anything, not committed any fraud nor are my actions based on knowingly deceiving the organisation. Other than using £3,200 of their money to make your phone calls you mean.
I am so shocked by this. I have a right to appeal but I no longer trust the organisation to make an objective assessment of my case. Any advise would be appreciated. Your appeal must be looked at based only on the facts. What reason have you to suspect that they will not be objective or fair?

I do no think that your employer has acted incorrectly and I think that spending over three grand of their money on your personal phone calls can legitimately be considered gross misconduct. However, the judgement is harsh.

I would appeal, explain that you had no idea that this would incur a financial burden for the company and offer to reimburse their costs. No guarantee that you will be successful but you have little to loose.

Undervalued

MEM62 wrote: »

I do no think that your employer has acted incorrectly and I think that spending over three grand of their money on your personal phone calls can legitimately be considered gross misconduct. However, the judgement is harsh.

I would appeal, explain that you had no idea that this would incur a financial burden for the company and offer to reimburse their costs. No guarantee that you will be successful but you have little to loose.

Your appeal must be looked at based only on the facts. What reason have you to suspect that they will not be objective or fair?

The OP has only worked there for seven months so the appeal doesn't have to be looked at "only on the facts" or even at all!