MSE News: Easyjet passengers told they'll have to fly on Latvian airline's planes

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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Forumite
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    Trajedy .
  • agarnettagarnett
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    bagand96 wrote: »
    Given that you are so interested, you may find their website has an absolute wealth of information. Their fleet page http://www.smartlynx.aero/corporate/fleet has clickable links for each aircraft which offer 8 PDF docments about the aircraft including Airworthiness Review Certificate, Certificate of Airworthiness, Certificate of registration etc etc

    They also have a Company Documents page http://www.smartlynx.aero/corporate/company-documents which has their Air Operators Certificate, Operating License, Insurances etc

    It's fair to say easyJet will have done their homework in far more depth also.
    Ha amazing! I wasn't that interested but I must say I was curious enough to have a look since you found the page :p

    Isn't it somewhat desperate or naive to publish documents like that and questionable too as to why, I'd have thought - do Ryanair and BA and Easyjet and Jet2 do the same on their websites?

    Yes I am very sure indeed that Easyjet will have ensured that their interests are well protected - which means that a set of documents as sparse and incomplete as those on the website wouldn't satisfy them for even a blink of an eye!

    Question is, do you know why that is? To almost every reader of this thread, those documents are gobbledegook. So here's the starter question for 10, to those to whom the documents are not gobbledegook i.e. to those that know exactly what the documents purport to be, then what sort of further questions might be asked about them by a wise observer?

    Let me re-emphasise that I am sure that Easyjet have ensured that all the documentation necessary to protect their interests is in order.

    Documentation is one thing. It is not the be all and end all of any business or operation.

    There are other considerations (if you choose to consider them).

    Alternatively, if you choose to buy your ticket, close your mind and eyes at that point, get on a plane, and wait for your journey from A to B to end so you can exit the life support system that you voluntarily entered in order to travel in a impossible environment up to 10-12.5km above the earth, and to breath easy again on your own, in the open air with feet on the ground, then that's fine too. There are millions like you doing the same. You are indeed 'normal'.

    I'm not.
  • bagand96bagand96 Forumite
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    Question is, do you know why that is? To almost every reader of this thread, those documents are gobbledegook. So here's the starter question for 10, to those to whom the documents are not gobbledegook i.e. to those that know exactly what the documents purport to be, then what sort of further questions might be asked about them by a wise observer?

    SmartLynx's business is sub-chartering to other airlines, be it one off, or longer sub-charters like easyJet, Monarch and Thomas Cook are using. They don't fly any scheduled routes of their own.

    Its not uncommon for such companies to list to some degree their certifications on their websites. Obviously an airline looking to lease or subcharter won't just Google, have a quick browse of a website and think "looks ok from here, hire them". But as the forward face of their business its not unusual.

    easyJet will have done a lot more in depth review of SmartLynx and their operations, and in all likelihood will be performing ongoing monitoring through the period of their lease.

    I wonder where you draw the line between an acceptable and non acceptable operator ;)
  • CKhalvashiCKhalvashi Forumite
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    Ticket was a flight from A - B at the quoted price, and that is all. That won't change.



    Smart Lynx Latvia callsign is Smart Lynx. Smart Lynx Estonia is Tallin Cat.

    Callsign will be 'Easy' though, so completely irrelevant.
    agarnett wrote: »
    Isn't it somewhat desperate or naive to publish documents like that and questionable too as to why, I'd have thought - do Ryanair and BA and Easyjet and Jet2 do the same on their websites?

    Nope, plus if an airline needs a frame quickly, all the paperwork is there already, Smartlynx isn't a scheduled airline, and specialises in ACMI (Aircraft, Crew, Maintainence and Insurance) to other airlines.
    Let me re-emphasise that I am sure that Easyjet have ensured that all the documentation necessary to protect their interests is in order.

    Documentation is one thing. It is not the be all and end all of any business or operation.

    There are other considerations (if you choose to consider them).

    Show me evidence of crew training or aircraft maintainence not being in order. Don't have any? Don't call the airline unsafe then.

    I'm sure that the crews are as well trained as Latvian pilots flying for Ryanair, Wizz or any other European airline, and I'm sure that the fleet is well maintained. I believe that their Maintainence Director is ex-Monarch and has British qualifications, but don't quote me on that.
    "I kada sanjamo san, nek bude hiljadu raznih boja" (L. Stamenkovic)

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  • coffeehoundcoffeehound Forumite
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    Latvia and Estonia are Members of the European Aviation Safety Agency the same as is the UK. The company docs show that SmartLynx has satisfied its respective National Aviation Authorities in those counties that it is capable of managing the continuing airworthiness of its fleet rather than farming this function out to a third party as some small operators do. In theory, these accreditations should be acceptable at face value since the auditing will have already been done through those lines of regulatory oversight. In reality though as others have said, the lessee will have no doubt done their own due diligence as well.
  • edited 16 March 2017 at 11:14PM
    agarnettagarnett
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    edited 16 March 2017 at 11:14PM
    CKhalvashi wrote: »
    Callsign will be 'Easy' though, so completely irrelevant.
    You may think it irrelevant, but choosing to brand a business perhaps as some 'smarter than the average cat' displays something that is not lost on me.
    Nope, plus if an airline needs a frame quickly, all the paperwork is there already, Smartlynx isn't a scheduled airline, and specialises in ACMI (Aircraft, Crew, Maintainence and Insurance) to other airlines.
    Indeed, does it? Does it maintain Easy?
    Show me evidence of crew training or aircraft maintainence not being in order. Don't have any? Don't call the airline unsafe then.
    I was careful not to say anything of the sort except that I would prefer not to fly with them if I had booked Easyjet. I only quickly scanned them, but some of the dates on documents suggest further documents must exist.
    I'm sure that the crews are as well trained as Latvian pilots flying for Ryanair, Wizz or any other European airline, and I'm sure that the fleet is well maintained.
    Good for you. That means you can do the normal thing, and sit back, relax and enjoy your flight then ;).
    I believe that their Maintainence Director is ex-XXXXXX and has British qualifications, but don't quote me on that.
    Indeed. Then I won't quote you! As an aside, have you noticed how many City firms and FTSE 100 firms have honours titled British directors - it's been a trend for a couple of hundred years. Some say it makes the company look good.

    Said director's business card wouldn't look good though if it spelled maintenance the way you do, Sir!
  • budgetflyerbudgetflyer Forumite
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    I think Stelios once said " If you think health and safety is expensive, try having a plane crash ! "
    IMO there is nothing to be concerned about.
    Most aviation disasters are "black Swan" events. From what I remember,Air France have been unluckier than most European airlines
  • edited 17 March 2017 at 10:23AM
    agarnettagarnett
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    edited 17 March 2017 at 10:23AM
    Most aviation disasters are "black Swan" events. From what I remember,Air France have been unluckier than most European airlines
    If you don't understand what can be learned from "unluck" in aviation, just say so, bf.

    A common European Sky and a common European safety regulatory body does not guarantee consistent safety - it does hopefully signpost the way.

    I would be interested if someone could tell us (and this is not rhetorical - I would genuinely be interested) why the last Aircraft Review Certificate (ARC) shown on the website for YL-LCN (the aircraft I read about in press releases relating to the Easyjet contract) expired in 2015. What does it mean? Website publication error? Presumably there will be a current Airworthiness Review Certificate? I note that the aircraft's actual Airworthiness Certificate was signed by a Latvia CAA inspector whose name appears on other Smartlynx certificates for other aircraft, alongwith a first Latvian ARC in 2014 - that was a few months before the current VP Technical was appointed with a role as Smartlynx Engineering Manager for a year, of "Control of Continuing Airworthiness". I note he signed the current MA901 ARC extensions for the Estonian registered aircraft including ES-SAK which paper trail includes this German issued/Irish and then Estonian amended ARC. I find it quite fascinating in practice, how many inspectors from different CAMOs and NAAs can get involved in certifying a single aircraft inside a couple of years.

    So ... not sure whether YL-LCN is currently on an MA901 extension. As I said earlier - these website documents look so much gobbledegook to most readers, but to others, they tend to raise further questions (which I have no doubt Easyjet have asked - and more!).

    As a further aside, and from the documents on their website, I note that as at earlier this year at least, Smartlynx themselves seemed to be leasing YL-LCN from an owner registered as a Delaware company. A number of the others appear to have Irish owners. As regards the aircraft operator, Wikipedia says that as of 2016, a Netherlands-based investment fund became the owner of the company.


    Smartlynx About page says they own 14 aircraft in 2017 and their website does host documents for A320s which are not directly referenced within their main webpages.
  • jpsartrejpsartre Forumite
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    SmartLynx also operates flights for Norwegian. It's a complete non-issue.
  • PeacefulWatersPeacefulWaters Forumite
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    How many SmartLynx planes have crashed?
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