Motoring offence, crossing red x on motorway

Marbo

OP edited on 21st of Feb

I am being prosecuted for failing to comply with red X/lane closure on motorway. I am defending against it because I believe the officer makes a mistake. I drove on a probably closed lane but I haven't noticed the red X or the police car.
-it was a manual detection. What does it mean: she wrote my reg number in a notebook or she used a handheld device? In her statement is mentioned a ANPR camera but after I asked for any ANPR records I received an answer that 'no material to disclose'
-I pleaded not guilty. In case I am found guilty can I add mitigating circumstances after that?
- The officer wasn't present at the first hearing but her presence is required because I am challenging her statement. The second hearing was rescheduled because she couldn't attend court in that day. If she can't attend court, the hearing is postponed again, can I ask the charges to be dropped?

In the first post on this subject I was wrong about the location of where they spotted me, I've made the false assumption it was at the point of re-entry on M1, where I was trying to push in to the queue of lorries.

According to the officer I've passed under the red X ,in lane 1, after I passed the incident that was obstructing lane 1 and the hardshoulder. It is possible, sometimes they keep closed the next segment after an accident as well.

I have the records from "HALOGEN" for the gantry before the accident....they show a change in the signage just 4 minutes prior to the time if the alleged offence, they opened lane 2.
They "ommited" to send the records for the next gantry, I'll try again being more specific.

marlot

>> the officer makes a mistake in Notice of Intended Prosecution ...
Minor errors on the NIP don't make it invalid

>> In her written witness statement the officer uses gantries numbers ...
Other people seem to find them. eg. https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/variable_speed_limits_m6_toll_ga

>>it was a manual detection. What does it mean: she wrote my reg number in a notebook...
I believe so. The policecar was probably also equiped with ANPR.

>> I pleaded not guilty...
That is your right.

>> The officer wasn't present at the first hearing but her presence is required ...
I can imagine the combination of shiftwork and other duties make this common!

>> I drove on a probably closed lane but I haven't noticed the red X or the police car,
Sounds like you need to increase your observation?

agrinnall

So you admit you're guilty but you're trying to find a technicality that you can use to wriggle out of a punishment? This may be a money saving site but we're really not here to help law breakers.

jobdone1

I read it you admit you did see the sign because you say if was heavy traffic and difficult to change lanes. So imho you should for your best outcome plead guilty.

Aylesbury_Duck

I'd plead guilty. From your own account it comes across that you know you were guilty. You made a mistake, which happens from time to time and is forgivable. Don't try and wriggle out of it on a technicality.

Mercdriver

All the police officer has to do is give a witness statement that she saw you cross a gantry with a red X above it. She does not need anything electronic to capture your transgression. In England and Wales she needs no corroboration from another person for her evidence to be valid. It is up to you to introduce sufficient doubt to make a conviction unsafe.

Remember though that as she has no material reason to say something, that her evidence may be given more weight than yours, since she has nothing to gain from it.

Whether you could see her car or her or not is no defence at all, just as speeding cameras require no warning signs to be shown in order for there to be a successful prosecution.

I doubt whether your 'mitigation' will help. How did you miss the red X? You are required to move and if you are driving with due care and attention, you would have been able to make the move to a lane that is open.

The purpose of the first hearing is just to plead guilty or not guilty. The police officer is not required at that hearing. You pleading not guilty takes it to full trial and you need to tell them you don't accept her evidence to make sure she is called for the full trial. You will have to pay costs for her presence if you lose.

You cannot ambush the court, you will have to let them know in advance what you are relying on for your defence.

To me from what you say, you have no defence and would be best advised to change your plea to get some credit for a guilty plea. Call the policewoman as a witness and you will see a total bill upwards of £1000. Contested trial = £620 + surcharge + fine + other costs.

mark1959

Were you pushing in?

Marbo

I haven't seen that sign or the unmarked police car with flashing lights at the point where I've entered M1. If I've passed that red X, i doubt the officer was there, in that moment, to witness to the offence. I suspect my reg number was passed to her by her colleagues present at the place of the incident down the road.
We can't make statements about something we didn't saw.

soolin

As above, it doesn't seem like a good idea to appear to admit to something on a public forum and then try a no guilty plea. Also if th ebasis of your appeal is that an officer is lying then I doubt you will stand any chance at all. Going to court could result in this being very expensive for you especially with a defence that appears to be you missed any red X, you didn't see the Police car (that has no relevance BTW) and you think the Office is lying.

However, the best place for advice is:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/

However they don't like being messed around so think before you post.

soolin

Marbo wrote: »

The case is dealt with at St. Albans Court in Hertfordshire.

so now you have a slam dunk for identifying yourself on an open forum.

Marbo

soolin wrote: »

As above, it doesn't seem like a good idea to appear to admit to something on a public forum and then try a no guilty plea. Also if th ebasis of your appeal is that an officer is lying then I doubt you will stand any chance at all. Going to court could result in this being very expensive for you especially with a defence that appears to be you missed any red X, you didn't see the Police car (that has no relevance BTW) and you think the Office is lying.

However, the best place for advice

However they don't like being messed around so think before you post.

I don't admit being guilty but I am trying to cover all possibilities and make the best decision.
Maybe I didn't saw the police car becouse wasn't there and didn't saw the red X becouse wasn't there. (malfunction or the signs were changing, they went off for a few seconds).
Thank you for participating and for the link.