Electric cars

gzoom

David_Aston wrote: »

Great post gzoom.
Can I ask you what you would consider, the least amount of money, an ice to Tesla convert, would need, including home charging to get on the road in the UK?

If your talking about going EV the best value car is the Hyundai Kona or Kia Niro EV, so your looking at £30kish. They are both great cars.

You need to be a bit mad to spend the kind of money Tesla want for a S/X, which starting this morning is going to be £90k as Tesla is dropping the 'cheaper' S/X from their range. Even the 'cheap' Model 3 that is due in the UK will be £50k when it arrives in this summer!!!

A used Model S is getting better value for money, but your still need the best part of £40-45k to get into a 4/5 year old Model S.

The Kona for alot less ££££ has more range than my 75D X and matches the £90K 100D X for range.

HOWEVER, if you like cars and enjoy driving them Tesla is still the best EV package. We are currently looking for a second EV, and an AWD Model 3 or a used 100D Model S are rhe top candidates. Although I think we'll wait another 18 months or so as I do like the look of the Audi eTron GT.

Our X will stay with us till its 8 year unlimited miles battery/motor warranty runs out, if we didn't have any EV I would be looking for a used P85D S for around £55k.

Yes the Kona and Niro EV offer more range for less ££££, but cars for me have never been about saving money/getting value. Nearly 24 months into Tesla ownership I still smile everytime I get into the car, I cannot say I would feel the same about the Kona/Niro, yes there would be more £££££ in the bankaccount but you only live once. I had the chance to bank a £4k 'profit' after our first Tesla was written off 18 months ago, instead I put paid £4k to get into another Tesla. As they say 'there is one born every minute

Martyn1981

gzoom wrote: »

10 days later 54% charge.

Great explanation, so around 180Wh per day, or 30p(ish) total, did you budget that into the holiday cost?

NigeWick

Martyn1981 wrote: »

simply haven't taken 'rapidgate' as seriously as they should..

Still ongoing. It appears there's a software fix that helps with rapid charging but Nissan aren't proactively telling owners about it. I gather they're just updating when servicing. Nissan obviously do not care about their customers or how they are seen by the public. At the price, the 62kWh Leaf is way behind the competition.

almillar

Could I ask you guys, how well modern electric cars hold their charge?
If I don't start our Jazz for two months, say, I don't expect that the petrol in the tank will fail to work. With a current electric, might I need a bit of charging, beforehand?
what I am getting at, is an additional expense of electric cars possibly, for a low mileage user such as myself?

Two month old petrol will work just fine.
So will an electric car. The charge doesn't go anywhere. The percentage reported by the car can vary depending on temperature - so you can come home after a big drive in the winter and stop the car at, say, 50%, with the battery at 20 degrees, but when you get in the next morning, at 0 degrees, you might be at 45%. And that's just overnight! But that's temperature.
The traction battery (the big one that moves the car) will be fine - as discussed a few threads up, if you're storing your car long term, don't store it empty or full. I don't think 2 weeks really comes under that. Where you can suffer is the same as petrol/diesel cars - EVs (right now) still have 12v batteries that do the same stuff - run the accessories. But they don't have a big engine to start, so they're generally smaller. Meaning they're easier to discharge over a short time. They need to be charged the same way as on petrol/diesels - they charge when the 'engine' is running (oh, and when plugged in too). On my Zoe, the 12v battery is recommended to be replaced every 3 years - ours lasted about 2 weeks short of that before causing problems.
So the shorter answer to your question - you're fine, as long as your 12v battery is in good condition. If you're at home and just not driving, you could literally switch the car on every week, or something, for say 10 mins, and the 12v will get topped up. A mere glance at the comparative size of the two batteries should tell you what a tiny impact this will have on 'charge'.

I can't see it being a problem with an EV. I would expect the static drain on an electric car's battery to be roughly similar but, in comparison, the battery capacity is huge.

except the huge battery is disconnected when the car is switched off, so you're relying on a little 12v battery.

Thanks for your comments guys.
So, purely on a running cost basis, the cost of petrol/diesel is replaced by the increase in one's electricity bill in order to charge the car. Additionally, presumably, the constant trickle charge to ensure it will start after two months does become a significant extra compared to oil based fuel?

Absolutely not. You're recharging a 12v battery with either petrol or diesel via spinning an alternator, or simply via a charger from the traction battery. Which do you think is more expensive? The cost of electric you for fuel, or for replacing 'vampire' discharge, is nothing like the cost of petrol/diesel. The clue is in the name - 'trickle' charge - that would be comparable to petrol/diesel cars.

Its not unusual to see 2-5% drops in battery capacity when left overnight

I don't have a Tesla and haven't heard about this before, but see my comments above about temperature. On your 90D 5% would be 4.5kWh - that's huge and I don't think the computer and data could burn through that if it wanted to!

Great post gzoom.
Can I ask you what you would consider, the least amount of money, an ice to Tesla convert, would need, including home charging to get on the road in the UK?

Cheap Model S £40,000. Home charger <£500. Done.

Martyn1981

I love it, but I'm about $120k short.

Mullen Technologies Opens Reservations For Limited 300-Mile Qiantu K50

According to the Mullen release, the Qiantu K50 is still on target to be released by the end of 2019. It will be available in two versions, Premium and Sport +. The limited signature series will have a 100 kWh battery, 800 Nm of torque (590 lb ft), 447 kW (600 HP) and 0 to 60 in 3.2 seconds.

The official price was announced as well — $123,500.

Martyn1981

The floodgates aren't open, they haven't even sprayed the locks and hinges with WD40, but at least Ford is starting to look for the keys.

Ford Says An Electric F-150 Is Coming

buglawton

Kia e-Niro wins What Car of the Year Award
https://www.itv.com/news/2019-01-22/electric-vehicle-wins-car-of-the-year-award-for-first-time/

The comparison with the Kona is here:
https://www.whatcar.com/news/new-kia-e-niro-vs-hyundai-kona-electric/n18764

AdrianC

Kia e-Niro announced as What Car? Car of the Year.
https://www.whatcar.com/awards/content/car-of-the-year/2019-overall-winner/kia-e-niro-first-edition/n18631

Seems an odd choice, given that the "vanilla" plug-in hybrid version only gets three stars out of five in their review.
https://www.whatcar.com/kia/niro/estate/review/n17190
The things they complain about in that review (mediocre drive and ride - yet they compliment it as quiet and refined) won't be improved in the 400kg heavier electric version, either, and they then go on say as much in their review of the EV version...
https://www.whatcar.com/kia/e-niro/estate/review/n18388/on-the-road

Seems that they're using very different standards by which to judge, depending on power-train. Autocar were certainly much less impressed.

Surely there can't be an accusation of fiddling...?
(Joke, btw, Niro-Nero, fiddle, Rome burning...? No? Oh. OK.)

Herzlos

I dare say the E-Niro has a completely different ride from the regular Niro - much heavier suspension, different weight distribution, no combustion engine.
So it's entirely possible the E version is a lot nicer than the hybrid version. I haven't driven either.


Edit: Reading the actual review it all sounds pretty positive, the only downsides seem to be engine noise (not an issue in the EV) and it being a bit twitchy on the motorway. They seemed impressed with the ride, lack of body roll, space and equipment. So I can certainly see why they'd view the EV version more favourably.

AdrianC

Herzlos wrote: »

So I can certainly see why they'd view the EV version more favourably.

Sure. But would it turn something mediocre into the "car of the year", assuming everything's being held to the same standards regardless of power-source?