ESA Support group in for a ROUGH ride 2017 (Support group to be CRUSHED!)

nannytone_2

JakiT wrote: »

Lanzarote, there is a very good caption of a picture of a person standing (rather than a wheelchair) saying that 'sometimes disability looks like this'. Yes, you are right that disabilities are different and that being disabled and long term sick are not synonymous. And many people who claim disability benefits are not born with them but that does not make their illnesses any less real. Many people with 'disabilities' do not think of themselves as 'disabled'. That is why many people talk of disabilities and the long term sick or chronically ill. It is just easier to subsume it under the disability for easiness sake. And for the sake of claiming benefits, some of them are known as disability benefits. Many people who are obviously disabled in wheelchairs may not in fact be as incapacitated as those who are not. I have no idea why the government got rid of Incapacity Benefit because that was what it was for. People who are incapacitated. Disability benefits also include many people with fluctuating conditions who would be unable to work because it would worsen their conditions. But there are many people, as you say, who are ill in the short term...they recover and go back to work. That has always been the case and always will. That is probably by far the majority of people who claim ESA.

for most people, the distinction between illness and disability is timing.
a disability lasts forever while an illness doesnt

dippy3103

Savile wrote: »

These are the people that pip/dla is supposed to help. This is the perfect example of where the scrounging lazy parasites are screwing the system for the truly needy. If the government did not think people are taking the pi$$ they would not be reviewing it so much.

This. It's the cheats and the fraudsters that are stealing from the needy and the genuinely ill.

I have a disability - you wouldn't know it to look at me most of the things me. At present I work with a couple of reasonable adjustments. Eventually I will deteriorate enough to not be able to work- hopefully not for a long time.

Sixer

Savile wrote: »

These are the people that pip/dla is supposed to help. This is the perfect example of where the scrounging lazy parasites are screwing the system for the truly needy. If the government did not think people are taking the pi$$ they would not be reviewing it so much.

No: this is the system where government is spending £1.5 billion on testing for a net saving in benefits payments of £1 billion.

I don't like those who cheat the system any more than you do. But I don't support spending more to find them than is saved by finding them. Nor do I support punishing the innocent as collateral damage in the search for the guilty.

Here is a similar example from outside the benefits system. You are the owner of a small shop. Suppose you lose about £500 per year in shoplifting. You think to yourself that you'll get a CCTV system because you need that £500. But the CCTV will cost £5,000 to install plus £300 in maintenance per year. And there's no guarantee that CCTV will ensure every shoplifter is caught so you'll still lose part of that £500. On a cost-benefit analysis, you put up with the £500 annual loss. It costs more to fix the problem than the problem cost in the first place.

(Thanks to those who gave helpful suggestions upthread.)

Mojisola

nannytone wrote: »

for most people, the distinction between illness and disability is timing.

a disability lasts forever while an illness doesnt

I don't think it's that clear-cut. I've had ME for over 30 years and can't see an end in sight.

nannytone_2

Mojisola wrote: »

I don't think it's that clear-cut. I've had ME for over 30 years and can't see an end in sight.

i have a friend in your position.
she does have periods where she recovers sufficiently to return to work ( she's a primary teacher) and other times can go a year or more when she is totally unable to work.

i would call it a significant illness, but not a disability.
, even though its effects are disabling

Mojisola

nannytone wrote: »

for most people, the distinction between illness and disability is timing.

a disability lasts forever while an illness doesnt

nannytone wrote: »

i would call it a significant illness, but not a disability.
, even though its effects are disabling

That's exactly my point - I have a disabling illness which has lasted for 30+ years and is likely to continue.

I am more disabled by the illness than some 'disabled' people I know so trying to say 'disabled' people have longer term needs than 'sick' people is wrong.

[Deleted User]

Sixer wrote: »

My cousin's husband has a form of muscular dystrophy. He has held down the same full-time job for about 20 years. For about 10 of those years, he's had a Motability car. He's at a stage where he can walk fairly reasonably with crutches. However, his legs give way intermittently, so he needs an adapted car with hand-only controls otherwise he would be a danger to other road users and pedestrians. Without an adapted car, he cannot drive. Although he can walk with crutches, it's a slow difficult affair and he could not use public transport to get to work. Clearly, his condition is degenerative so there is no chance of his mobility improving in future.

He's just had his Motability car taken away after a PIP assessment. He is appealing and his employer is holding his job open even though he cannot get to work at present. But they can't do that forever and the appeals process takes forever. Given his condition, it's unlikely anyone else but someone who's known him for 20 years will take him on.

There's a good chance that he'll end up without a job he's held for 20 years and will then be reliant on the state for daily living as well as mobility.

So much of this stuff is penny wise and pound foolish. Even if you believe the welfare state is too generous, why would you support a system that spends a pound to save a penny? That makes things worse not better even on austerity-is-necessary terms.

Also, there is a reason collective punishment is illegal under international law. If you can only locate cheaters by punishing non-cheaters, then your system is bankrupt.

I wonder if this person's MP would be able to help? Depends on the MP of course, but can't do any harm and might speed things up or be able to ask pertinent questions. I'd also suggest getting benefits advice from the CAB. They can help (word things to maximise a positive outcome) with appeals too.

FBaby

The government wants to save money and do not care which group of people suffer.

Many people will suffer one way or the other, we all tend to be focused about how we as individuals will suffer though rather than anyone else. Human nature.

Pop_Up_Pirate

campervan33 wrote: »

My husband has alzheimers and just four weeks ago (applied in february) he was put into the support group for esa. Last week we both had a letter from JCP to attend a meeting with a job coach. I work part time as well being his carer, he has also been diagnosed with acute asphasia so it will be an interesting appointment. I got really stressed when the letters turned up but have calmed down and will just attend, it will also be interesting to see how the job coach will communicate with a man who can barely string 2 words together.
I did call the DWP to see if they had made a mistake calling us in but apparently not. I just dont get it, Im working he has AZ diagnosed several years ago !!

How do you work and claim carers allowance at the same time?
I was under the impression you can't do that?

FBaby

Not every carer systematically claim CA. You can also work and claim CA as long as you remain under the -low- threshold.