Potential Severe Damage caused by end of Tenancy Cleaners

[Deleted User]

<Yawn> unless cleaners used water pump and high pressure hose pipe without any attempt to suck up the water.., and the LL didn't keep windows open for a few days.., the house shouldn't be smelling of damp for more than a couple of days. Golly gosh, he could do what tenants are told to do.., use a dehumidifier.

And tenant still shouldn't be charged for cost of replacing whole house of at least 3 year old carpet.

I do agree however, that a tenant could have used some elbow grease and got on hands and knees and cleaned the carpet themselves.., on a regular basis. I have done it with cloths and carpet shampoo without a shampooer. Never a smell of damp. Just used towels to dry carpet. It is possible that the carpet was so dirty the cleaner was a bit over enthusiastic with the shampooer. However, the carpet should still dry out if proper airing is applied.

FBaby

You don't know what the cleaners used, what we do know is that it was bad enough to damage the downstairs flat ceiling, which would indicate that the damage is not unsignificant. How do you know how long it would take for it to dry and not remain damp and smelly?

We don't know the cost of the damage, hence my recommendation to go via ADR if what the landlord requests seems extravagant.

theartfullodger

So much for the vaunted "professional cleaning" demanded by many tenancies

[Deleted User]

The OP knows that the LL SAID there was sufficient water to cause damage to the downstairs property.

It doesn't mean its true. Rather unlikely as said, unless a hose was left running for quite some time. This level of water use is highly unusual with carpet cleaning. Which tends to make me think the LL is overstating things, together with his claim that all the 3 year old carpets need replacing at a cost of £3k.

Just a hint in there somewhere that the LL is taking the OP for a ride.

FBaby

The OP said that he had no reason not to believe him and that he's been a good landlord. I don't understand why you seem so convinced that the damage is not as bad as what he claims and he is only saying so to make money out OP?

Indeed, this 'accident' would be very unusual, but then maybe it was a new member of staff who hadn't been trained properly, who knows? I think it is quite presumptuous to assume at this stage that the landlord is a rogue.

[Deleted User]

As I have said, if the cleaning company did what the LL said, then evidence is required so OP can claim from cleaning company.

If the LL wants to take the OP's whole deposit, evidence is required to make a successful deposit claim.

I am definitely thinking that the LL is overstating their case. Evidence could prove otherwise.., but where is it?

Countist

As I mentioned before we'll get a final decision on this tomorrow, I just wanted to be prepared etc.

Which everyone has been very helpful with thanks!

I guess there are 3 scenarios

• Landlord claims the carpet is damaged beyond repair and supplies evidence
• Carpet is fine
• Landlord says carpet needs replacing and doesn't provide evidence

1 is actually what I'm most concerned about, if he was actually a rogue landlord and suggested 3 (which he isn't) then I'd go straight to the TDS to get it sorted (and there'd be no evidence and it'd be fine). I have rented and had problems with managing agents specifically before and I'm familiar with how to deal with that. But this situation was different.

The comments re claiming new for old etc are useful though.

Out of interest would the landlord's insurance potentially cover it? Presume not or it would have been suggested...

FBaby

I think you've come to the correct 3 scenarios.

If it comes to scenario 1 with evidence of it, than you will need to either come to an agreement over the cost (and your LL needs to understand the rules that he can't claim for betterment even if he loses financially as a result because ultimately, the carpet will need replacing), or if you can't reach an agreement, you let ADR do so.

Of course, you could sue the cleaning company for the full cost and assuming you won your case, could give something to your landlord out of goodwill (that would really be up to you). It's a long way before you would even be in that position though.

Re. your last question, it is more likely to be covered under 'content' insurance as per the definition:

buildings insurance covers the structure of the building, plus permanent "fixtures and fittings" such as baths, fitted kitchens etc. The test is - can it reasonably be removed and taken to another home- If it can, then it is part of the "contents" and it will not generally be covered by a buildings policy. Buildings policies usually include outbuildings - garages, garden sheds etc.

Did you have content insurance and if so, have you tried to see if it would cover it?

Countist

That's actually a good point, I didn't think it would be covered under contents I guess it's up for debate whether carpets can reasonably be removed and taken to another home

I'll check the T's n C's...

Edit: Carpets are covered but we don't have accidental damage cover, not sure whether this would class as "accidental" or not.

Edit 2: Think it excludes water damage, except from domestic appliances/storm too so probably a non-starter unfortunately. I will try though if needed.

[Deleted User]

I hope you are able to come to a reasonable solution. But ask for evidence if he persists in the carpet needing replacing 1) Age of carpet, 2) Evidence that whole of carpet needs replacing 3) Cost of carpet. If he seems to persist in going down the replacement route, find an equivalent carpet and present evidence of the cost. £3k seems rather expensive and the carpet is not new etc.

I suspect if he persists, his present attitude won't do him any favours with the arbitrators.

Also remember he is saying the place wasn't cleaned properly. Evidence is needed of this.

I suggest that if you rent again, take photos on moving in, be around after cleaners have been round on moving out, take photos. Could save a lot of trouble (not that this situation could have been anticipated lol.., never heard of cleaners inundating a place with water AND not cleaning a place properly before lol) but if a tenant is having a place cleaned, they need to make sure it was done properly as at the end of the day the buck stops with the tenant.