Father asking for money for a favour done

Ryiah

Hi,
My husband and I had an extension built, my dad who is a painter and decorator offered to paint it for us. No mention of money was ever discussed, so we assumed he we doing it as a favour. Now he has handed us a list of all the hours he did and the payment expected - which he said was a heavily reduced rate he normally charges. We always intended giving him some money for his time and travel, as he was here a lot, but no where near as muchas he's asking! We also let him stay and paid for his meals etc during his time decorating.

What annoys us most is that if he said he'd be charging us from the start, we would've done most of it ourselves, but he kept insisting it would take us too long and he'd be quicker! We arent even that happy with the standard of work he has done - wallpaper not lined up right, edges not cut in well, patches on the ceiling where he ran out of paint and used a different type - but we just let those slide as we thought he was doing us a favour! Had we been paying another decorator we would've been right on their back.

Not only that he never listened to what we wanted, we wanted the finished rooms done first so we could move in to them, but he'd take it on himself to do the other rooms - the joiners werent even finished in those rooms yet, so they then made a mess and the rooms had to be repainted!

Also a lot of the time he wasnt solidly working as he'd chat for ages with us, have long lunches, play with the kids, yet he still has a full working day down on his hour list.

We're really not happy and we have told him we didnt agree or expect him to bill us. But he said it took up a lot of his time - which we agree it did, but that couldve been prevented had we known he was going to bill us! We had planned on using the money to get our utility room installed - which we wont be able to do for a few months while we save up more!

What should we do? Pay up and grin and bear it or pay what we had always intended to pay (less than half the amount asked for).

Thanks!

pollypenny

Do you normally get on well with your father? Did he miss out on other paid work?

It's going to be difficult, but you'll have to be honest about your expectations and disappointment. Be prepared for fallout.

ERICS_MUM

My brother in law is a builder by trade and has done small-ish jobs for me over the years, but no matter how small, I've always asked him to give me a price before he starts. Often he will charge for materials but not labour if it's a job taking a couple of hours but for work taking a day or more he will discount his usual rates. I would never assume anything. By the same token if I'm less than happy with the work I will ask him to sort it.

In your situation I would amend his invoice to reflect the hours he actually worked, plus point out "the last few bits to be finished '. In a kindly & informal way and take it from there. If you don't have that sort of relationship it might be better to just pay-up to keep the peace !

warby68

It seems odd that this has come as a complete surprise and you didn't know your father's ways and expectations and if you didn't know the situation well, discuss it at the outset.

If he is charging you 'commercially' then maybe you will have to act commercially and agree to pay but after he has corrected the things you let slide because you thought it was a favour and adjusted for the hours worked.

I can't see how this is anything but very uncomfortable anyway so you might as well try for a quality finish.

If you think its so bad he is trying to rip you off then you could get an estimate of your own to compare his price to. If he is genuinely still cheap, although it doesn't sound like it, you may feel better.

You could also ask if he is prepared to wait for you to save up so you can complete the utility room as planned first.

FreddieFrugal

What an awful situation!

It may well have taken up a lot of his time but from what you've said he wanted to do it. If there was no mention of money beforehand then he can't expect you to pay.

You already paid for his upkeep while he was doing the work.

What's appalling is that he convinced you to let him do it to help you out and speed things along - as a family member - then given you a surprise bill at the end of it!

Major clash of understanding there. When you spoke to him did he admit that he'd made no suggestion about charging beforehand. Or did he think he'd made that clear?

[Deleted User]

Hi,

is your dad self-employed?

If so, then he could've been earning money on other jobs.

If not, then he should be doing it for 'family', so, cover his expenses and bung him a few beer tokens.

chesky

My son in law is currently painting the front of my house and I'm paying him. But I asked him to do it and made it clear I'd be paying him. Previously he's done the odd thing for me like installing my new dishwasher and I haven't paid him, although he is a kitchen installer. At those times, he's offered to do it and we always understood he was simply helping me out.

Perhaps you should make a charge for dinner and board. And what's that list called, where you write everything down that isn't completely satisfactory about the work and needs to be fixed.

chesky

Just re-read your post. I hope you're not paying for work that had to be redone. Only you know your father but it strikes me that if he's done a shoddy job, you must have known beforehand that his work wasn't of the highest standard. I only asked my son in law to do the work because I was sick of getting ripped off by people like your father trying to charge me for crappy work.

warby68

Thinking about this, your father has been working full days in summer.

A good painter and decorator would have been booked up months in advance for this time of year.

Family favours tend to be done by tradesmen in the evenings and weekends fitted in around their paid work.

With what you said about the quality of his work and his 'availability' I think the clues were there that he needed this work rather than was offering a favour. Unless he's semi-retired or something.

It doesn't help much but certainly evens up the relationship a bit in that you were also possibly doing him a favour

FBaby

I was going to say that there was maybe a misunderstanding from the start, easy to get to this when both parties are not even considering from the start the alternative (paying vs not). However, it seems from what you are saying that your father didn't intend on charging you, but then changed his mind after it was finished.

Only you know your father and whether this is out of character of him or not. Is he normally unreliable, saying things and then changing his mind, giving mix messages.

Assuming that this was out of character, my first thought was that he is financially in trouble and desperate to find cash, so turned to this as a way out of some debt. Could this be a possibility?

GlasweJen

I'd ask him to fix all the bits you're not happy with, bill him for food (not tea as I expect most tradesmen get a cuppa and a biscuit on the job but certainly wouldn't expect a full lunch and dinner), and deduct time spent chatting and playing with the kids and re-doing rooms that he shouldn't have been doing in the first place.

I'd also get a price from another tradesman for the job as painting and wallpapering an extension shouldn't cost the price of installing a utility unless it's a massive extension.

He's already made the situation awkward so you might as well get the job done properly if he wants paying. Just tell him, we didn't agree to pay you and we are not willing to pay [your bill] for the quality of finish you've provided, we were willing to let it slide as you said you were doing us a favour. If you rectify X, Y and Z we will pay you [new calculation] which accounts for time spent playing with the kids and having family time, I've also deducted lunches and dinners as we wouldn't normally feed a tradesman.