Incentivising Learning

theoretica

Andypandyboy wrote: »

How much harder it is to work with your chid and encourage them to see the long term results, to see from example, that good results may actually enable you to dish the dosh....

It is very true that it can be harder to work with children in that way. Depends on the child and the parents. What if it proves too hard? A grumphy teenager who sees encouragement as nagging, or parents who are insufficiently persuasive?

If people fall short of perfect should they keep trying what isn't working? Give up? Or consider all other methods? Most people, parents, kids and the adults they grow into, are far from perfect and need to live with this.

Andypandyboy

theoretica wrote: »

It is very true that it can be harder to work with children in that way. Depends on the child and the parents. What if it proves too hard? A grumphy teenager who sees encouragement as nagging, or parents who are insufficiently persuasive?

If people fall short of perfect should they keep trying what isn't working? Give up? Or consider all other methods? Most people, parents, kids and the adults they grow into, are far from perfect and need to live with this.

My feeling would be that if you have laid the right foundations (which doesn't start at age 16) then you are unlikely to come to that stage. That has also been my experience and the experience of those closest to me in terms of family and friends. Honestly, if I had had to resort to paying my kids to work hard at school or for exam results, I would have considered I had failed as a role model.

Of course, there is no "perfect" there is "good enough" or as good as it gets. Acknowledging that is part of the exercise.

theoretica

Andypandyboy wrote: »

My feeling would be that if you have laid the right foundations (which doesn't start at age 16) then you are unlikely to come to that stage.

I wouldn't disagree, except that many parents will be considering the matter at a time when it is likely to be too late to change the foundations in time.

onlyroz

You all talk as if it's bribery or nothing. It's simply part of your arsenal as a parent, along with the more conventional means of encouragement.

FBaby

I'm not convinced though that the best way to address a child's lack of effort is with the resolution that involves the least effort on the part of their parent.

I think a lot of this stems from parents having few 'adults' discussions with their children. I have always spoken to my kids about my adult life in the way they told me about their children lives. Of course, it was adapted in a way they could understand and made it clear that my 'adult' issues were mine and not theirs.

However, by the time they were 6/7, they understood the concept of insurance and saving, by the time they were 10, they understood what a mortgage was and the difference between owning and renting. By the time they were 12, they knew how much I earnt and how I spent the money.

I am very fortunate that both my kids are naturally academic, which means that they get some level of enjoyment going to school and even doing homework, however, my concern was that they would take it for granted, so I've talked to them about the fact they were lucky to be clever, that it was their 'gift', like others are gifted in sports/music/leading others/business minded/creative etc... and they had to make the best of it, ie. work hard to make the best out of it.

Yesterday, I took DS to a special occasion and he was over the moon. I got his school report this week-end which was excellent, how I expected it to be as it has always been. I didn't say that the trip was a reward but I said the timing was good! I also slotted in one of the conversation that the only reason I could afford to take him to places like this was because I could afford it an I could because I had a well paid job.

That doesn't mean that I expect them to go for a high paid job, because what they see is also a very tired mum most of the time, but I want them to be able to have as much exposure to what adult life is like so they can make choices that suit them rather than end up like so many adults who say 'If I'd known, I would have work harder at school, I would have gone into this career, I would have.....' I always considered that my role as a mum was not not only making sure they had a great childhood but that they were also well prepared for a great adult life.

I think bribery can have one positive outcome in some cases, and that is exposing the child to what it feels like to accomplish well when they put the effort in. After all, how can a kid do something for the sense of pride if they have never experienced it before? If paying a 15yo £30 to work harder at their GCSEs means that they experience pride and motivation for the first time, and these feelings mean that the £30 is well forgotten replaced by the desire to experience pride again, then yes, I can see the motive as a one-off.

Detroit

For those in favour of the financial incentive, I would be interested to know what you consider to be the going rate? Also whether you think it would be effective if you can't afford to match the price paid by other parents?

I discussed this with my child yesterday, who tells me in their circle the incentives differ greatly.
One child has been promised £100 for every A grade, another, £10 per GCSE, while someone else will be receiving a new car if they get sufficient GCSEs to get into 6th form.

This is apparently the subject of some discussion, and in some cases seems to be backfiring a little. The person heading for the £10 per GCSE has been advised 'its not worth it, I wouldn't bother for that' by those able to command higher 'fees'.

Obviously, there will always be variations in what a child receives materially, according to the family means, so I wondered how parents who operate this method ensure they stay financially competitive?

Madmel

Interesting debate! DD1 is very hard-working but was worried about a couple of her GCSEs. We promised her a tenor saxophone if she achieved straight A* grades. She then countered this by saying she wouldn't achieve it in my subject (I was not her teacher) so I offered to give her some help, which was accepted. I ended up shelling out for the sax but she has since had some prestigious performing engagements and paid pit work (musicals), so it was a bit of an investment.

Both daughters have taken many music and dance exams. I got fed up of them moaning about practising scales. To me it's a no-brainer: if you know your pieces and scales well, you pass the exam without needing to rely on any of the unfamiliar elements (sight reading and aural tests). So if they pass, they are praised. If they achieve a merit, they receive half the exam fee as a reward - fees increase as you go up the grades. If they get a distinction, they receive the whole exam fee as a reward. However, if they fail, they owe me the full exam fee. It has become rather expensive for me, but they definitely put the work in now and their results have been great, including a grade 8 with distinction, which also carries UCAS points.

Our system is not right for everyone but it works for us. The girls know what will happen and prepare better as a result.

Spendless

My Mum who is not naturally academic was told by her parents that if she passed her 11+ they would buy her a bike. This would be back in the 1950s. She didn't pass, so no bike was forthcoming. She thinks she later received one the following Christmas or birthday as a present. It's a story she told me only a few years ago. What makes me wonder though is why my Grandparents thought my Mum could pass an 11+ 'just like that' when she wasn't/isn't naturally the brightest and without them giving her some extra support or guidance (I think the story came about, due to some private tutoring I'd paid for for one of my kids).

My Grandmother had indeed passed her 11+ 'just like that' the only girl in her year who did so, so I'd have thought she'd have had more of an idea of my mother's academic capabilities.

MPD

Detroit wrote: »

Obviously, there will always be variations in what a child receives materially, according to the family means, so I wondered how parents who operate this method ensure they stay financially competitive?

Unless there is familial mobility then this will have to be a case of take whats on offer.

Detroit

MPD wrote: »

Unless there is familial mobility then this will have to be a case of take whats on offer.

The point of an incentive is that it must be sufficiently attractive to the recipient that it influences their behaviour.

A 'take what's on offer' approach wouldn't work unless the offer was considered sufficient by the child.

This may well be outside of parental control, if children set the value of the task by comparison with the offers made to their peers.