IN/OUT Trump card time...

ruggedtoast

Carl31 wrote: »

I think the whole things rigged anyway, The EU realises its in for problems, so if they could get one of the bigger powers to show its worth staying in, the smaller countries will think twice about jumping ship too, hence Cameron and co have had a bung to make it happen

Possibly very true.

kabayiri

The 77,000 recent arrivals to the UK from the EU who did not have a job to go to must look like low hanging fruit to the Remain team for a response.

It wouldn't mark a dramatic shift in EU principle to say that people need an economic plan to move within the EU on a permanent basis. That usually means the ability to sustain oneself financially or a job which enables you to do that.

It would show a "listening, more caring, EU" as well

Sapphire

I hope the outcome will be Leave. There is so much that is badly wrong with the EU: issues of democracy; the attempts to force widely different sovereign countries into some sort of 'political union'; the attempt to hide from the population that this was the aim of the EU all along; the dangers of open borders, especially at this present time; the growing economic disaster that the Eurozone has been particularly for smaller European countries; the quality of people like Merkel and Juncker, who would never have survived this long in a democracy, and the lack of ability to boot out dictatorial individuals like this; having decisions made somewhere far removed from our country that may be completely wrong for us; the prospect of more impoverished countries joining the EU and dragging Europe down further economically; the prospect of Turkey joining the EU, which is something Merkel would permit even if other countries in the EU disagreed – she has form on such actions.

In my view we need to detach ourselves from the political aspects of the EU – there is absolutely no reason why we need to be part of an 'ever-growing political union', run by Germany – and forge economic links with countries of the EU and countries worldwide. We do also need to limit migration from the EU to those who benefit our economy, and to have much better control of illegal migration from countries outside Europe who come here freely via the open borders of the EU countries. Taking in all the people that want to come here would bankrupt our country, as well as deeply affecting social cohesion (this is already happening increasingly intensely in other European countries that are the most deeply affected).

Were we to vote not to leave, I believe at least half the population would feel deeply and increasingly resentful that it has been forced into a situation it does not want, and our society would be deeply divided. Some people are still passionate about the democracy and independence of sovereign nations, which was achieved through centuries of struggle.

So I'm voting Leave.

mwpt

Coswallop. So many inaccuracies and stupidities. Merkel wouldn't have survived in a democracy? You should write to the German people explaining they don't have a democratically elected leader. On that note, are you from a nationality which has traditional tensions with Germany? You seem to really dislike Germany in particular.

Thrugelmir

mwpt wrote: »

Coswallop. So many inaccuracies and stupidities. Merkel wouldn't have survived in a democracy? You should write to the German people explaining they don't have a democratically elected leader. On that note, are you from a nationality which has traditional tensions with Germany? You seem to really dislike Germany in particular.

Merkel's own rating has fallen dramatically. Many of her views have not gone down well at home. Which has been amplified in regional elections. The whole issue is far more complex than the UK vs the 26.

mwpt

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Merkel's own rating has fallen dramatically. Many of her views have not gone down well at home. Which has been amplified in regional elections. The whole issue is far more complex than the UK vs the 26.

Sure, but is Merkel democratically elected or not?

Thrugelmir

mwpt wrote: »

Sure, but is Merkel democratically elected or not?

We'll find out next year. If the people wish her to remain in post. Or whether public opinion is against her policies. Like the UK there's increasing polarisation of views. The EU's primary aims were to create stability in post war Europe. Currently seem to be creating the opposite. With nationalism and independence (of states) rising to the fore.

Mistermeaner

perhaps out should play the immigration card - that might swing it

padington

Out lost any momentum the minute someone killed an MP shouting 'Britain first'.

Fingers crossed ISIS keeps their dirty nose out of it and Jo Cox's life might just have saved the United Kingdom from a death by a million cuts, division and disunity.

Going from the poor man of Europe to flowering into the capital of the world is something to cherish, not burn.

It's when our workers are leaving in droves to work elsewhere we need to worry, certainly not now.

CLAPTON

padington wrote: »

Fingers crossed ISIS keeps their dirty nose out of it and Jo Cox's life might just have saved the United Kingdom from a death by a million cuts, division and disunity.

seriously?