HELP: CIFAS Marker Category 6 Misuse of Facility

HibertyLand

Hello All,

I am looking for your advice and guidance on a case of mine that I am currently dealing with Lloyds Bank.

On the 25th March, my wife opened a Lloyd’s account. She received her sort code and account number with the Debit Card and PIN sent to her separately. With her Sort Code and Account Number at hand, I transferred £4000 to her account. On the 7th April, a fraudster intercepted out post, withdrew £1,500 from the counter in a Lloyds branch. When my wife called to find out where her card was, it was revealed to her what happened. She raised a claim, and Lloyds refunded the £1,500 the next day which was nice as we weren’t expecting to be refunded.

On the 25th April, both our Lloyds Current Account Debit cards stopped working. We could not withdraw or make purchases. I was on a journey home with my 3 year old son, and I was stuck on a motorway as I was unable to pay for petrol. I had to have a friend drive to us to sort us out with cash. I called Lloyds on the day but they told us that they couldn’t help us and that the account was to be closed for fraud but that they couldn’t tell us more.

On the 26th April 2016, my wife and I went to Lloyds to confirm what has happened as we were not given a reason as to why there were blocks on my account and why they were going to close our accounts. To our dismay, we were asked to withdraw all the money we has in the accounts and that our accounts had been flagged up with CIFAS. I had no idea what it meant at the time, but after days of searching on all the forums, it turns out that Lloyds has placed both our names with CIFAS under (Misuse of Bank Facilities) which will remain on our account for 6 years! After several calls to the complaints team, Lloyds are holding us responsible for the fraud which happened on the 7th April. They confirmed the CIFAS entry too. How can they do this with no actual proof? Their arguments is:

• My wife opened a Halifax account and a Lloyd’s account at the same time. (which she did)
• Why didn’t I keep the money until pin and card has been received? (I didn’t feel it was necessary, we had received the sort code and account number. Of course now I see how necessary that was.)

Since the CIFAS marker, my wife and I have grounded in into a financial halt. We are unable to open a bank account anywhere, manage our money, insure our home, insure our car which I need for work, receive child benefits for my 3 year old and even maintain a simple mobile phone contract. All our current bank accounts elsewhere have been closed. Once the marker is on your name, it is virtually impossible to get a tangible financial service of any kind! We are unable to do any of the above due to the rash and inconsiderate behaviour of Lloyds. I have asked time and time again (via phone calls) for Lloyds to provide information on the alleged fraud which took place on the 7th April, but Lloyds have not answered. I truly believe that Lloyds have acted in the wrong and that the CIFAS marker placed on both our names is unwarranted.

I have contacted the financial ombudsman, but they told me that they will look at our case in 2 weeks’ time, which is really bad.
I don’t know what to do, it’s so frustrating.
Has anyone experienced this? Do I have a case, or will we have to live under a rock for 6 years?:(:( I am so upset

Candyapple

On the 7th April, a fraudster intercepted out post, withdrew £1,500 from the counter in a Lloyds branch.

How is that possible? Whenever I have tried to withdraw a large sum of money over the counter I have always been asked to show photo ID and also address - usually in the form of a passport, driving licence along with bank statement etc.

Why would they withdraw only £1.5k instead of the whole £4k?

How did they know the account had any money in it at all? Unless you are saying they intercepted your wife's first bank statement too?

Why were you not expecting the money to be returned when you called up and asked about the card's whereabouts? Most people would be livid and would not rest until they had received a refund, especially if someone had stolen their details and the bank had failed to follow procedural guidelines to prevent any fraud.

I think you need to see a solicitor and see if they can help you to speed up your case, otherwise you are looking at a very long winded process of waiting weeks/months on end for letters/replies/decisions/appeals to be made.

HibertyLand

How is that possible? Whenever I have tried to withdraw a large sum of money over the counter I have always been asked to show photo ID and also address - usually in the form of a passport, driving licence along with bank statement etc.

It depends on the bank. You can withdraw up to £1,500 with card and PIN. Which bank do you bank with?

Why would they withdraw only £1.5k instead of the whole £4k?

At the time, that’s all they could withdraw. The daily counter withdrawal limit is £1500. We called the day after the fraud took place so if we had left it longer they might have taken more it they wanted.

How did they know the account had any money in it at all? Unless you are saying they intercepted your wife's first bank statement too?

If you have a PIN and card, then they can check it using a cash machine.

Why were you not expecting the money to be returned when you called up and asked about the card's whereabouts?

We wasn’t expecting the money to be returned straightaway. We thought the investigation would have taken place first before a conclusion and pay was made.

I think you need to see a solicitor and see if they can help you to speed up your case, otherwise you are looking at a very long winded process of waiting weeks/months on end for letters/replies/decisions/appeals to be made.

I know, I think a solicitor is the best route. It is such a shame it has to come to this. I feel like the FOS are/ and will take the !!!! when it comes to this sort of stuff. I feel like they will always side with the banks.

Candyapple

HibertyLand wrote: »

It depends on the bank. You can withdraw up to £1,500 with card and PIN. Which bank do you bank with?

I was withdrawing £2k from Halifax.


Interesting article here:
http://www.theguardian.com/money/2015/sep/12/big-cash-withdrawals-bank-barclays-denied-access


Did the fraudster use a bank branch local to you?

Did you report the theft to the police?

The branch would have CCTV and if you also had irrevocable proof that you/wife were elsewhere (work? another shop? etc.) during the time of withdrawal that will also help your case.

Do you know if any other post has been stolen?

Do you live in a block of flats (i.e. shared access to letterboxes) or are you basically accusing your postie?

Did your wife call up Lloyds to ask about the whereabouts of her card the same day the theft took place? I can see how that might look suspicious.

Was there any mention on the phone call about an investigation taking place?

I definitely think you need legal advice because otherwise you are going to be left without any banking facilities/form of credit for a long time before this mess is resolved.

In the meantime, this might be of use:
http://www.thinkmoney.co.uk/

xylophone

I have never received a card and pin number in the same post.

Is there some factor which makes intercepting your post easy?

Presumably the fraudster was able to find out how much there was in the account by using card and pin in an ATM - have Lloyds checked the card usage for this - is there any photographic evidence?

• My wife opened a Halifax account and a Lloyd’s account at the same time. (which she did)

Why should this be a problem? Having an account with both is not against the terms and conditions of either bank.

Why didn’t I keep the money until pin and card has been received? (I didn’t feel it was necessary, we had received the sort code and account number.

Is it in the terms and conditions that you may not credit the account until you have received the card and pin or is there anything on the bank's web site/in their literature advising you not to credit the account until the card and pin have been received?

HibertyLand

Thanks for your post guys! I am going to write a letter to CEO of Lloyds outlining all the questions you are asking. I am really going to push for this. I will let you know what they say. I will answer all your questions in the mean time.

GingerFurball_2

HibertyLand wrote: »

At the time, that’s all they could withdraw. The daily counter withdrawal limit is £1500.

no it isn't.

starM

Lloyds use card and pin for branch cash withdrawals.

How did that 3rd party knew your pin number?

john1002

Think they said at the start, intercepted mail.

John

typistretired

Scary. I have in the past put money into accounts once I see them online. Will be a bit more careful in future.

karlie88

xylophone wrote: »

I have never received a card and pin number in the same post.

Have to say I've had quite the opposite experience - it's happened on several occasions with me; especially with BoS and Halifax. Don't know if it's the banks' fault, Royal Mail or a combination of both....am I the only one to experience this?

To the OP, I hope it all gets sorted for you. Like you, I deposit money into a newly opened current account even before I receive my debit card/PIN. I will have to change this habit, not really worth it in order to gain an extra £1.50 in interest.

If you haven't got an outside/shared mailbox, could you potentially have a 'dodgy' postman/woman?