Options for family member who cannot budget

t0mbop

Hi guys,

I'm hoping for some advice on what to do with a family member (my Mum) who quite simply cannot budget. I'm 29 now and live with my wife and are expecting our first baby in June. Mum lives on her own in her mortgage free house. What's come to light in the last few years since my Nanny's passing is that Mum has a history of poor budgeting, bad credit and borrowing.

My Nanny left her £65k inheritance in 2013 which has been spent, apparently on "bits". She doesn't drink, drive, smoke or do drugs, although any one of those being true would at least explain the problem. Over the years she's borrowed money of various family members without being able to pay it back usually to fend of creditors and on a few occasions bailiffs. This came to a head recently firstly when I found out about this history and then when she asked me to borrow money and I flew off the handle. We had a large family discussion with her and said it needs to stop which she said it would and it hasn't. It's still a problem, and given it's been a problem for the past 20+ years it seems unlikely to change now.

She works part time as a school cleaner and quite frankly doesn't want to do any more, despite that being part of the solution, and I cannot force her. We've all told her as a family what we think is best and she nods and agrees then goes and does the complete opposite or lies about it.

So, what are my options? My cousin suggested approaching Mum about Power of Attorney? I've googled it and to be honest not sure I can be bothered with the hassle but the grief I'm getting at the moment with her not managing it properly is worse. Mum, to be fair to her, would probably just agree to it as I think she'd see it as a welcome relief. Someone else would be dealing with the problem which as far as she cares is great.

She keeps asking me for help in sorting it out but I cannot support her financially. It's been a problem for many years in many different circumstances and scenarios and everyone's always bailed her out for which she's eternally grateful and it won't happen again, then it does.

What do I do? Her income is greater than her outgoings as she has no mortgage, car, debt (I can see her credit report now - with her permission on Noddle) or vices. She just simply cannot budget. She draws out cash all the time and it just gets used on "stuff". I can assure everyone here that no amount of sitting her down and telling her either in simple terms or angry terms will work, as I can't watch her 24/7.

Is Power of Attorney an option? At least then I can handle her minimal affairs for her? It's degrading really but I don't know what the other options are? I understand that if more is coming in than on the face of it is going out then that leaves a surplus, but she obviously has additional expenditure that she is either somehow hiding or more likely just "spending" as she has so much free time on her hands only working part time. She won't or can't tell me what it's being spent on and I cannot force her, but she's my Mum - I can't see her destitute!

Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks

System

£65k is a lot of money to get through in three years, if she doesn't know what it's been spent on.

I assume from your post that she is a healthy, compus mentis lady in her 50s/60s who is just not that good with money? Can you direct her to this website? It might inspire her a bit :money:

Sorry I can't advise re. the power of attorney.

DomRavioli

Power of attorney is for someone who does not have the mental capacity to make any decisions - as deemed by either a medical professional or a court of law. It has no relevance to your argument whatsoever, it is usually used for people with either severe mental/physical health problems who cannot make decisions at all, or for those with geriatric illnesses such as dementia. If she is able to work then this will not apply to her.

Perhaps speak to either your local council/jobcentre/CAB and see if there are budgeting courses locally (most places will either have them or be able to tell you where they are run). She may be unable to deal with the maths side of things properly, have you asked about her skills in this area?

And if she's spending out of boredom/habit, suggest volunteering in an area she enjoys. There's a lot of not for profits and charities who would happily take her for a couple of hours a week and hopefully get it under control, as well as setting an example for her.

But you also need to realise that she is her own person - you cannot force or coerce her into behaving in a way you may think right. You also have to let her deal with the consequences of her actions - by "bailing her out" you are reinforcing the negative behaviour. The only one who can change it is her, you can help her but you cannot do it for her (that seems to come across in your post).

Even direct her here. We're a friendly bunch (for the most part), and if she can't or doesn't know how to do something we will always try and help.

meritaten

I am sorry - but she IS an adult and has to deal with this herself or face the consequences!
you can only help and advise - its up to her to curb her spending habits.
I can understand that her squandering that inheritance without a thing to show for it must be upsetting (gutting may be a better word), but, it was her money and her decisions.
may I suggest she has a 'spending addiction'? or she is supporting someone secretly? Point her in the right directions to get help and I know it sounds harsh, but please DONT take over her finances - there may be more to it than you know and you don't want to end up legally liable.

t0mbop

Thanks for the replies. The Power of Attorney sounds like a ball-ache anyway (for me) so until it's necessary I'll avoid that. As for directing her here, well she can't use a computer. The damage she manages to do to her financial state without the constant threat of betting sites/phishing/online shopping is bad enough than introducing her to all of that, so she won't be coming here.

She is healthy, compos mentis (I suppose, although I do wonder), and 60 this year. I understand we're reinforcing behaviour by bailing her out (reminds me of puppy training) but what else am I to do? Could you honestly see your Mum in financial dire straits just to learn a lesson? I think it's easier said than done. I completely understand she's her own person, but she's relying on me more and more to help her with this stuff yet not heeding my advice. If I get angry with her she cries and goes defensive, if I try and talk to her calmly she makes all the right noises then within a week she's drawing out money like it's going out of fashion. I like to think she's not manipulative as she's my Mum and appears very vulnerable, but she sure seems that way sometimes.

I've asked her if she's giving money to anyone else as that would explain the loss of inheritance but she insists not. All I can do is see what liabilities she has legally, i.e. cards/loans etc and there is nothing.

I wonder if there's any sort of bank accounts or limitations she can have put in on her current account to aid her - she's with Barclays.

System

She could open a basic account with no overdraft facility so that at least she doesn't go into the red.

Would she agree to keep a spending diary?

meritaten

I am not very au fait with banking services - but if she is going overdrawn every month or racking up credit card debt - perhaps switching to a debit card and have a 'no overdraft' policy on her account? I did this because my bank had a nasty habit of paying direct debits before the agreed date and the money went in to cover them - thus running up overdraft fees you wouldn't believe!

enthusiasticsaver

Power of attorney is for someone who cannot manage their finances due to mental or physical incapacity. I cannot see it being relevant for your situation. She would have to hand over all control of her bank accounts and credit cards leaving her with no access to money beyond what you give her in cash. I would not advise you getting involved. To go through that amount of money some sort of shopping, gambling addiction may be a possibility. If she has never learnt to budget and needed help in the past I cannot see her changing. I think there must be some secret vice you are unaware of and beyond suggesting she make a note of everything she spends I cannot see a solution.

enthusiasticsaver

Is she only drawing cash out? I am sorry but if you keep bailing her out she has no incentive to change. Given you are strapped financially I cannot see you have any other option but let her sort it out herself if she won't listen to your advice.

t0mbop

Can you insist with a bank that an account cannot go overdrawn? I know it sounds daft but I think my account will "allow" you to go overdrawn but charge you for it - even outside an overdraft. I think she could benefit from literally nothing. She has direct debits for house insurance etc (which she didn't have til last year - don't ask!) so can't go completely basic.

She does use gas and electricity on a key meter but she's dead against a direct debit so she has to draw cash to pay for that. I'm trying to think of ways of minimizing the need for withdrawing physical cash.

KRB2725

Does she have any known mental health issues such as depression? Compulsive spending can be linked to MH.

If that's the case or you suspect it may be then I think a trip to the docs would be a good starting point.