The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

kabayiri

mollycat wrote: »

The thing is the people who post the stuff you are responding to don't even worry about their fellow Scots, or respect their democratic right to have an opinion.
...

I do think there are some valid issues around how the Westminster government is remote from regional spending.

But there is no inherent reason that people in Yorkshire or Newcastle or Cornwall are any less deserving than those in Ayrshire or Aberdeen.

mollycat

kabayiri wrote: »

I do think there are some valid issues around how the Westminster government is remote from regional spending.

But there is no inherent reason that people in Yorkshire or Newcastle or Cornwall are any less deserving than those in Ayrshire or Aberdeen.

Which has been my point consistently throughout this thread....we are all British, lets sort stuff out together.

Just so you know, people here DO know they get a good deal financially. If that were to change you'd get no "toys out the pram" from most of us.

Im 100% sure I have much more in common with some people from Newcastle, Yorkshire and Cornwall than I do some of the pro -indy posters on this thread.

It's not about which bit of earth you stand on!

TrickyTree83

mollycat wrote: »

Which has been my point consistently throughout this thread....we are all British, lets sort stuff out together.

Just so you know, people here DO know they get a good deal financially. If that were to change you'd get no "toys out the pram" from most of us.

Im 100% sure I have much more in common with some people from Newcastle, Yorkshire and Cornwall than I do some of the pro -indy posters on this thread.

It's not about which bit of earth you stand on!

They (the independence supporters) have been sold lies. Just look at what happened to the first indy ref white paper when the reality of the future came to pass. Lies, lies, lies.

The irony when they complain about the EU leave campaign isn't lost on me. I'm not saying they're wrong about Vote Leave or Grassroots Out, they certainly spouted some rubbish, as did Britain Stronger in Europe, just the irony of castigating lies whilst also supporting lies is fantastic grim humour.

posh*spice

mayonnaise wrote: »

I wish the Scots all the best in seceding from an increasingly xenophobic little england, where EU nationals are regarded as 'negotiation cards', refugees need dental checks, Poles are being kicked to death in the streets and companies who employ foreign nationals need to be 'named and shamed'.
Get out while you can and good luck!

Why don't you move to Scotland? Given how little you think of us English I'm not sure we'll miss you :T

.string.

posh*spice wrote: »

Why don't you move to Scotland? Given how little you think of us English I'm not sure we'll miss you :T

Nope - that's not the way to show support to the Union. We are better than that.

Shakethedisease

elantan wrote: »

Just reading through the draft bill just now, can't see any real surprises as of yet

There's been a few subtle changes.

2.15 The draft bill proposes changes to the checking of postal votes statements. These require that the personal identifiers on all postal voting statements are checked. While the statutory requirement at the 2014 referendum was that not less than 20% of personal identifiers were to be checked, in line with normal practice at other elections the counting officers checked all personal identifiers. The bill therefore proposes to change the legislation to require 100% checking and bring the legislation into line with previous practice and accepted practice at other elections.

2.16 In schedule 3 of the 2013 Act, rules 10 and 29, which set out rules relating to the appointment of polling and count staff, are amended by the draft bill so that the counting officer “must not knowingly” appoint or employ anyone who has been involved in campaigning during the referendum. This change reflects recommendation 19 of the Electoral Commission’s report on the 2014 referendum.

Hopefully this means Ruth Davidson won't be visited by police next time for sampling the postal votes weeks before the vote and reporting back to HQ.

Shakethedisease

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

They (the independence supporters) have been sold lies. Just look at what happened to the first indy ref white paper when the reality of the future came to pass. Lies, lies, lies.

You think half of Scotland are gullible ?

The irony when they complain about the EU leave campaign isn't lost on me. I'm not saying they're wrong about Vote Leave or Grassroots Out, they certainly spouted some rubbish, as did Britain Stronger in Europe, just the irony of castigating lies whilst also supporting lies is fantastic grim humour.

You were a Leave voter though. Where did you get all your information from to decide which way to vote if you don't mind my asking.

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

Thank you mollycat, I take great pleasure on reading your words.

Maybe it's a good time to revisit some poll results that Shakey very kindly gave us some time ago (Post 3086 posting a survey reported by the Sunday Times). It shows that the majority of Scots want a future within the UK, preferably also within the EU. Glad to hear that message from you again Mollycat.

In the interests of balance, I should point out that Shakey thought it proved that the poll showed first choice was to join the EU, of course without the UK. She is, of course, entitled to her own (wrong) opinion.

I'm still not sure how your maths is to be honest. Those polled for the Scotland inside the UK and in the EU no longer count and will have to cast their votes in another category (28%). Why does that make me wrong you haven't said and I'd be grateful if you did ?

Also, this poll was well before the current May Govt revealed how far right the Tories are currently heading.

Thrugelmir

sss555s wrote: »

One thing that seems clear from the last few posts is that in general, those from the South don't trust the Scottish government and those from Scotland don't trust Westminster, May or the UK press media.

D-I-V-O-R-C-E

Sturgeon has made it clear she expects Scotland to remain in the UK. Doesn't appear that she has much interest in the actual outcome of the negotiations. As will merely be used as another excuse to justify the cause. Simply so predictable. Tedious in fact.

TrickyTree83

Shakethedisease wrote: »

You think half of Scotland are gullible ?

There will be a proportion of the Yes vote who thought Salmond & Co. were on the level regarding oil prices remaining high, Scotland having a dividend for each household and Scottish streets would be paved in gold.

They were not on the level were they...

Shakethedisease wrote: »

You were a Leave voter though. Where did you get all your information from to decide which way to vote if you don't mind my asking.

A myriad of sources, mainly online since that's where I live.. sad I know. I would do my best to fact check across sources, that became more difficult over time due to possible associations generating significant bias. So for example, the media may say something, a blog would or a friend or family member, and I would go away and try to find out if it was true and whether or not I liked it or not with regards to the EU. Eventually I would say my vote was 49% Remain 51% Leave, not too far from the actual result itself.

Pouring over the EU website, old news reports (less inclined to bias due to the impending referendum), current reports, tabloids, TV, radio, the ONS website and the data they provide, other similar institutions, CBI, IFS, IMF, my own observations, information from friends of mine who migrated here from the EU, the UK government information, Vote Leave, Grassroots Out, Britain Stronger in Europe, MSE forums, Facebook, Twitter. I watched plenty of debates on Youtube that took place in Universities around the country, which is where I came across Daniel Hannan. Google was my friend for quite a while trying to fact check what these people would say.

It was probably Daniel Hannan's version of events and vision which probably persuaded me the most that leaving was the correct decision, I also still agree with him regarding migration. I don't think he's stupid to support leaving the political union and to say that migration could and perhaps should continue. That single market access (as good as we can get) should be the aim as long as we're still able to go out and strike our own trade deals. Then we're not hamstrung by Italian tomato growers, French sugar farmers, German car manufacturers and any other lobby group from within the EU with their own self interests. Immigration is way down the list for me.

I would say I'm a soft-brexiter, I'd fit in with what Scotland would like and with what business would like. I don't identify with the immigration crowd but I can understand their issues. I just feel that if we were able to maximise our potential that we wouldn't need to be so bothered about migration as everyone would be a winner in the end. The per capita earnings in Norway and Switzerland are much higher than the UK, that's something we can change by following their example.

Not a hard line libertarian, but I definitely have a stripe of libertarian-ism running through me. Free markets, meritocracy, personal responsibility, maximising potential. I would have voted to remain if the EU was able to change significantly, political union and fiscal union between the north, south, east and west of Europe was always going to be problematic. It's now so monolithic that the change they know they need to make will never take place, existing problems will grow into crises and new problems will emerge. They took incorrect decisions along the road of the EU project, it'll never be the same again. For me the EEC as it was would have been good, EEA/EFTA are the best options currently available. Ideally for me it should be a trade union in which business chooses to partake in or not, paid into by all member states. If your business follows the regulations you can sell into the market, if not, then you cannot. In this respect EEA/EFTA is quite a close match.