The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

My view is what will realistically happen. As long as a single penny of Scottish taxes go directly to the UK Treasury, then Barnett will have to exist in some form. End of discussion on that.

It'll won't be until after negotiations over debt/assets and shares of joint institutions are divvied up and agreed upon that Barnett to Scotland, and payments from Scotland towards joint UK debt and joint institutions like defence etc will stop. All of this will have to be sorted out beforehand.

You and Generali seem to be under some weird impression that a minute past midnight on any Yes vote, things as they are will instantaneously cease to be and Scotland will be using a new currency the day after. Barnett will continue until Scottish businesses and taxpayers no longer contribute directly via HMRC to the UK Treasury. More than likely even afterwards Scotland will use the £, for a while anyway.

You surely weren't thinking that after a Yes vote, Scotland would instantly be cut adrift and Barnett instantly stopped while HMRC still collected in Scottish taxes ? Or that Scotland would be allocated it's full debt share with no assets from 300 years worth of the UK or that Trident would just stay where it is ?

You seem to be under a weird impression that the English are going to be very keen to continue to subsidise the Scots if the Scottish are ever stupid enough to vote to leave the UK.

If the UK Government collects £100 in taxes from Scotland and then spends £115 in Scotland then you can expect that to stop PDQ if there is ever a vote for independence. I thought you wanted the subsidy to stop anyway, isn't the point of independence that Scotland pays its own way and stops spending Londoners' taxes on free parking and free universities (that Londoners get to pay for twice if they attend!).

Given that under a uniquely favourable set of circumstances you were unable to get anywhere near to a Yes vote I think it's reasonable to say that it's highly unlikely that Scotland will vote for independence in our lifetimes. Mostly, I suspect, that's because Scottish people aren't stupid enough to expect Londoners to keep paying a massive subsidy after they vote to quit the country.

Spoiler Alert If you vote quit the subsidy will stop. Quickly.

elantan

Went to the a lanarkshire SNP rally today, was quite interesting, the SNP have a strong presence here now and it's good to see, I didn't see any cultish behaviour just people taking a breather from campaigning to have some fun, admittedly though I think I frustrated a lot of them, today I was referred to as the floating voter, my reply was no floating voter suggests I will be voting, I've already told you I won't be, if I was I would give my first vote to the SNP, but as I'm not you won't be getting it ... I could hear the gnashing of teeth lol

Generali

elantan wrote: »

Went to the a lanarkshire SNP rally today, was quite interesting, the SNP have a strong presence here now and it's good to see, I didn't see any cultish behaviour just people taking a breather from campaigning to have some fun, admittedly though I think I frustrated a lot of them, today I was referred to as the floating voter, my reply was no floating voter suggests I will be voting, I've already told you I won't be, if I was I would give my first vote to the SNP, but as I'm not you won't be getting it ... I could hear the gnashing of teeth lol

Did they mention popping a Thank You card in the post to Londoners for the massive amount of cash that Londoners are sending to Lanarkshire and the rest of Scotland this year or are they waiting for Christmas so they can send a little gift too?

Innit.

elantan

I imagine they are still waiting from the one from London for the Olympic money and all the tax money from the oil from the 70's ... only unlike you they ain't bitter and holding their breath

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

You seem to be under a weird impression that the English are going to be very keen to continue to subsidise the Scots if the Scottish are ever stupid enough to vote to leave the UK.

If the UK Government collects £100 in taxes from Scotland and then spends £115 in Scotland then you can expect that to stop PDQ if there is ever a vote for independence. I thought you wanted the subsidy to stop anyway, isn't the point of independence that Scotland pays its own way and stops spending Londoners' taxes on free parking and free universities (that Londoners get to pay for twice if they attend!).

Given that under a uniquely favourable set of circumstances you were unable to get anywhere near to a Yes vote I think it's reasonable to say that it's highly unlikely that Scotland will vote for independence in our lifetimes. Mostly, I suspect, that's because Scottish people aren't stupid enough to expect Londoners to keep paying a massive subsidy after they vote to quit the country.

Spoiler Alert If you vote quit the subsidy will stop. Quickly.

Yes it will hopefully. But it will still be subject to mutual negotiations around UK debts, assets and Trident. HMRC is still a joint enterprise. 18 months or so should do it. But Barnett will continue while negotiations take place. You'll be wanting Trident back I suppose ?

I think it's reasonable to say that Scotland will vote for independence within the next 10 years or so, probably sooner around 2021. Support certainly isn't going anywhere anytime soon. The SNP will start pushing again and raising it on the agenda this summer, and they've been quite open about doing so. Scottish Labour are about to crash and burn spectacularly just like their Westminster counterparts did last May. Kezia Dugdale is taking absolute pelters on social media today over the Clyde shipyards, as is Ian Murray.

Sure there's independence for some might say at any cost. But Scottish Labour are very soon going to have to make the choice between softening their stance greatly, or else sticking to their 'union at any cost' narrative. One that has them at their lowest ever polling levels in a Scottish election. Once Labour 'turns' ( they'll be stuck where they are for a very long time if they don't ), that'll be the SNP/Labour/Greens and just about every other political party in Scotland apart from the Conservatives ( polling 14% in Scotland re UK elections ) advocating either independence or some form of radical Home Rule.

Logically, in a political union. The above can't really continue as the norm for very long.

Survnation yesterday.

Independence:
Yes - 48.3%
No - 51.7%


The EU:
Remain - 65.1%
Leave - 34.9%


Trident renewal:
Support - 32.1%
Oppose - 44.8%
Don't know - 23.1%

elantan

Aye the lassie would really do better to shut her mouth about the shipyards and accept defeat gracefully, she really isnt doing herself any favours

But as always fun to watch

Generali

elantan wrote: »

Aye the lassie would really do better to shut her mouth about the shipyards and accept defeat gracefully, she really isnt doing herself any favours

But as always fun to watch

Cor blimey guvnor!

elantan

I absolutely love how much using the language from the country I live in winds you up

You do make me happy Gen

You just can't help yourself, it must eat away at you till you can take it no more then reply in Cockney ... I don't know if you think it annoys me but let me assure you I love local slang and customs so please try and keep it up all the time not just when I appear to bother you

Or maybe you read my Scot's and think ohhh I like to read her Scots I should reply in kind with my Cockney, who knows ( apart from yourself) but either way it does tickle me

Oh and happy St George's day to those that celebrate it, hope your having a good one

Generali

elantan wrote: »

I absolutely love how much using the language from the country I live in winds you up

You do make me happy Gen

You just can't help yourself, it must eat away at you till you can take it no more then reply in Cockney ... I don't know if you think it annoys me but let me assure you I love local slang and customs so please try and keep it up all the time not just when I appear to bother you

Or maybe you read my Scot's and think ohhh I like to read her Scots I should reply in kind with my Cockney, who knows ( apart from yourself) but either way it does tickle me

Oh and happy St George's day to those that celebrate it, hope your having a good one

Yes it's a torment to me that is probably only matched by what was done to the Titans. That or I think you're a bit of a prat for writing in a fake accent and am taking the rise. Take your pick really.

It's ANZAC Day weekend over here so we'll be celebrating that tomorrow by going to the dawn service and having a couple of beers later on. Thank you for the St George's Day wishes and I wish you a happy ANZAC Day in return.

elantan

See those SNP... now they are to blame.for Scotland's obesity crisis ... handing oot sweeties in SNP wrappers, how very dare they