If we vote for Brexit what happens

CLAPTON

mayonnaise wrote: »

And we wouldn't want a governor of an independent BoE to have a view on the implications of brexit and express them either, would we? The plebs might not be able to deal with these facts, especially so shortly after Peggy Mitchell's departure from Eastenders.

the 'independent' BOE could have chosen to talk about the existential threat to the EU of the Greek crisis and the immigration crisis or TTIP or the rise of right wing parties or the threat to stability due to continuing high EU youth unemployment but it chose not to.

However, I welcome Carney's views just as I have welcomed his frequent pronouncements on the UK economy, unemployment rates, interest rate movement etc etc.
I treat the accuracy of these as indicators of the likely accuracy of his brexit views too. I'm sure all fair minded intelligent people do likewise.

Moby

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/17/farage-accuses-mandelson-and-labour-of-rubbing-our-noses-in-diversity
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/18/chris-grayling-refuses-back-boris-johnson-eu-hitler-comparison
Scratch under the surface.........between Farage and Boris.......not going well is it!

CLAPTON

Moby wrote: »

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/17/farage-accuses-mandelson-and-labour-of-rubbing-our-noses-in-diversity
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/18/chris-grayling-refuses-back-boris-johnson-eu-hitler-comparison
Scratch under the surface.........between Farage and Boris.......not going well is it!

funny how you never want to discuss policies but only personalities
so no discussion on whether supporting the killers in the IRA is good or bad or whether supporting Mao' murder of 40 million is good or bad, or Ken's anti-semitic view are appropriate or how Corbyn has been a long term brexiter
but just on who doesn't get on with whom.

Filo25

Good set of polls for the Remain camp in the last couple of days, although obviously helped hugely by a couple of phone polls coming out, which for reasons still not fully understood are far more favourable to Remain than Online, although even Yougov's online poll looks decentish for the Remain camp.

Moby

CLAPTON wrote: »

funny how you never want to discuss policies but only personalities
so no discussion on whether supporting the killers in the IRA is good or bad or whether supporting Mao' murder of 40 million is good or bad, or Ken's anti-semitic view are appropriate or how Corbyn has been a long term brexiter
but just on who doesn't get on with whom.

I see you are still trolling away with your distorted view of reality. As I've said to you many times......... repeating the same nonsense time and time again ad nauseum kills any discusion full stop!

Back to the topic in hand...........I reckon the Brexiteers have lost the economic debate and their one 'get out' is project fear over immigration. They will lose that as well because it is a negative message driven by the dog whistle politics of under the surface bigotry......those two Guardian links show this. Drawing parallels between the European Union project and the policies of Hitler is beyond the pale.....anyone who was sensible would see that and throwning up flak about Corbyn etc is the usual diversion you employ when you are cornered Clapton. You don't know the meaning of debate....to you this is all a virtual discussion....probably providing you with some meaning in your life. You need to get out more mate;)
By the way in case you didn't know policies are made by .....that's right..... people! You know this very well because you bang on about people you have a problem with don't you! So stop being a hypocrite.

Generali

Filo25 wrote: »

Good set of polls for the Remain camp in the last couple of days, although obviously helped hugely by a couple of phone polls coming out, which for reasons still not fully understood are far more favourable to Remain than Online, although even Yougov's online poll looks decentish for the Remain camp.

I follow this bloke quite closely:

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk

and he is fascinating (for me) on polling. It's not just about phone and online, it's about the different methodologies each company uses. Most companies are yet to update their polling methods fully to reflect the lessons learned from the last General Election.

Anyhoo, this post contains some parallel polling, polling using phones and interwebs:

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/9687

I can't remember off-hand which way round it was but Anthony Wells (and michaels) came to the understanding that the polling that favoured Remain was more likely to be right.

The difference between online and phone polling is the "Mrs Doyle question" in an phone poll. On the interwebs if you tick 'Don't Know' or some such they leave you alone, on the phone if you say 'don't know' then they say, "Oh go on, [STRIKE]have a cup of tea[/STRIKE] you must know"

Crashy_Time

Conrad wrote: »

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5453572

The Danish People’s party’s success in the election continues a trend of rising support for rightwing parties across Finland, Denmark, Sweden and Norway

• 
  http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2015/jun/19/rightwing-anti-immigration-parties-nordic-countries-denmark-sweden-finland-norway

• A far-right, anti-refugee party has won a landslide in Poland
  
  http://www.thejournal.ie/poland-elections-2409911-Oct2015/
• 9 Scariest Far-Right Parties Now In The European Parliament
  
  http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05/26/far-right-europe-election_n_5391873.html

• Austrian far-right party wins first round of presidential vote
  
  http://www.france24.com/en/20160424-far-right-candidate-comes-first-austria-presidential-vote-norbert-hofer

• Slovakia far right party election success shock
  
  http://www.reuters.com/article/us-slovakia-election-rightwing-idUSKCN0W80UB
• Hungary – far right gains ground
  
  http://www.euractiv.com/section/elections/news/orban-wins-elections-far-right-gains-ground/
• Front National wins in France
  
  http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/12/marine-le-pen-front-national-france/420348/

Class. Did the Poles put in their postal votes from the heartlands in London and Edinburgh I wonder?

Filo25

I followed on that site quite a bit during the last GE as well Generali, but haven't been on so much recently, as you say a good read and I will have to start following more closely in the run up to the referendum.

Unfortunately will be on holiday then, so will miss the immediate aftermath of polls closing, any indication at this early stage as to how soon we will know the result of the referendum after the polls close?

MataNui

BOBQ, 1975 was not a vote on the EU. It was a vote on something entirely different from what the EU is now.

We dont get a say. When was the last time a UK party spelt out its plans for the EU in its manifesto? Did John Major campaign on the basis that if elected he would sign the maastricht treaty? Did Tony Blair get elected on the basis he would have our rebate cut? We elect our governments in total isolation and ignorance to what they will do in the EU. That isnt the EUs fault but it is part of the problem.

You seem to be suggesting that the fact our elected representatives (who never make their position on the EU known BEFORE we elect them) deciding on ratifying EU treaties is somehow better than the system they have in place in other member states where the people decide directly. Its NOT the same. Same goes for new members. Its NOT the same. Any elected UK government will rubber stamp the next set of new members because its what the EU wants. Are you suggesting that the UK people would do the same? If there is a high likelihood that the people and the government differ on something of such importance then yes. 100 million is a bloody good use of tax payers money.

michaels

Crashy_Time wrote: »

Class. Did the Poles put in their postal votes from the heartlands in London and Edinburgh I wonder?

Funny you should say that

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-36305838

Votes for Poland in countries with most Polish migrants
Country Televotes
Germany 10
UK 10
Austria 12
France 7
Italy 10
Sweden 10
Netherlands 10
Ireland 10
Belgium 12
Spain 5

Source: Eurovision

This is the song that got a total of 7 points in the jury vote.