Current market carnage - anyone selling or buying?

tg99

EdGasket wrote: »

There was reference to only 1 in 10 spread-bettors being profitable by the industry themselves. 95% losing figure is well known to anyone who has looked into it. E.g. see the first paragraph:

http://www.spread-betting-strategies.org/financial-spread-betting-strategies/

You don't want to hear that because you are so much in love with the idea that you can beat the system but my money is on the bookies.

Your comment here demonstrates clearly that you do not properly understand in detail how spread betting works, the transaction costs/spreads involved, how the spread betting firms make their money etc. Absolutely nowhere have I stated that I am as enthralled with spread betting as your comment implies and nowhere have I stated that I am spread betting to beat the system. I have instead provided a range of ways in which spread betting can be used as part of a long term investment strategy whilst agreeing and acknowledging that most people who use it for short term gambling purposes will lose. I suggest you go through the maths of the costs involved when holding spread betting positions over the long term - as I do for some investments to complement my other holdings in funds etc - in order to help you understand why spread betting can be used sensibly in this way and is not about beating the system.

gadgetmind

A_Flock_Of_Sheep wrote: »

People are just as in love with the idea they can "beat the system" and make money out of funds. But of course it is a "broker" not a bookie that people pay their commission to in those cases.

You don't buy funds via a broker and you don't pay them (or anyone) commission.

Maybe you're thinking of something else? I don't have a clue what, but I'm sure it's something relevant.

gadgetmind

tg99 wrote: »

how the spread betting firms make their money

In spades, from mugs, good enough for me.

tg99

gadgetmind wrote: »

You don't buy funds via a broker and you don't pay them (or anyone) commission.

Maybe you're thinking of something else? I don't have a clue what, but I'm sure it's something relevant.

Yes you do in many cases buy funds through a broker, some will charge a dealing fee such as Iweb, Alliance Trust, others won't but charge you an annual platform fee instead. So there are costs involved with investing in a fund (as well as the ongoing charges) just as there are spreads incurred when taking out a position via a spread bet.

A_Flock_Of_Sheep

tg99 wrote: »

Yes you do in many cases buy funds through a broker, some will charge a dealing fee such as Iweb, Alliance Trust, others won't but charge you an annual platform fee instead. So there are costs involved with investing in a fund (as well as the ongoing charges) just as there are spreads incurred when taking out a position via a spread bet.

And I may be wrong but I am sure some funds also have delaings with derivatives and CFDs. The fund manager won't run a fund for nothing either.

tg99

gadgetmind wrote: »

In spades, from mugs, good enough for me.

That should not be good enough for you as if you took the time to look at and understand how they make their money then it would at least allow you to arrive at a properly informed opinion.

Yes some people who invest in spread betting are mugs and lose a lot of money but spread betting firms make the majority of their money through the spread rather than having naked positions as a result of client trades.

tg99

A_Flock_Of_Sheep wrote: »

And I may be wrong but I am sure some funds also have delaings with derivatives and CFDs. The fund manager won't run a fund for nothing either.

Correct. A lot of funds are permitted to use derivatives and CFDs for efficient portfolio management and others to implement investment views. Some absolute return funds sold to retail investors use CFDs to implement long and short positions in stocks for example.

WannabeeMillionaire

afly wrote: »

No mass selling here I'm trying to buy in fact but I'm starting to get very annoyed with charles stanley. I have monthly DD paid on 1st that they buy into an investment fund for me each month on "the 10th".

The problem is the 10th seems to be a very loose date. I havent had a single month go by when the stock hasn't risen before purchase. Just checking today, yesterday (11th), after 5 straight days of downward trend and surprise... no CSD purchase :mad:

I have exactly the same problem with Hargreaves Lansdown. Every month my regular savings purchases complete on 10th-12th and every month that seems to be the most expensive time.

Makkusu

EdGasket wrote: »

There was reference to only 1 in 10 spread-bettors being profitable by the industry themselves. 95% losing figure is well known to anyone who has looked into it. E.g. see the first paragraph:

http://www.spread-betting-strategies.org/financial-spread-betting-strategies/

You don't want to hear that because you are so much in love with the idea that you can beat the system but my money is on the bookies.

If you do the math, spread betting is the same as purchasing shares, but with the added benefit of being able to go short and not part with funds upfront.

It's a tool that every shrewd investor will use alongside the stock market, fact.

It's also a highly addictive form of gambling which will unfortunately make up the vast majority of its users.

You sound like you don't understand spreadbetting so I would stay away and your wallet will thank you.

A_Flock_Of_Sheep

gadgetmind wrote: »

In spades, from mugs, good enough for me.

There are some really good books on CFD's Spread Betting and derivatives. Even if you are dead set against the idea after reading at least take time to be properly informed. You may even be pleasantly surprised.

It is a shame these things are such dirty words on here.