David Cameron sets out EU reform goals

Generali

CLAPTON wrote: »

many would see that closer integration includes 'closer integration'


and that would mean things like fiscal and monetary policies as well as social and legal systems




but lets not be picky

I think the Treaty of Rome covers that. Closer union includes a commitment to the Euro.

In reality, all the UK has really had to do to address that has been standardising a few statistical measures.

wotsthat

It's going to be fun on here debating the referendum. Everyone has made up their mind and won't be changing it.

May as well have the referendum next month to minimise the disruption and uncertainty. It's not as if there can be many true floating voters - most people have spent most/all of their lives in the EU - how can they not have formed an opinion?

CLAPTON

wotsthat wrote: »

It's going to be fun on here debating the referendum. Everyone has made up their mind and won't be changing it.

May as well have the referendum next month to minimise the disruption and uncertainty. It's not as if there can be many true floating voters - most people have spent most/all of their lives in the EU - how can they not have formed an opinion?

yes,
given that cameron has excluded any mention of the totally free movement of people within the EU boundraries, then yes there is little to discuss.

wotsthat

CLAPTON wrote: »

yes,
given that cameron has excluded any mention of the totally free movement of people within the EU boundraries, then yes there is little to discuss.

I'm willing to wager this exclusion won't reduce the discussions around immigration a jot.

kabayiri

wotsthat wrote: »

It's going to be fun on here debating the referendum. Everyone has made up their mind and won't be changing it.
...

Interesting.

I saw Cameron's speech as a very public challenge to the EU, and I'd be hoping for an European response which is equally open.

The 4 year period before being able to claim local benefits for example. That would of course be reciprocal, and apply to Britains working in France / Germany / Poland etc. Why would this be a difficult thing?

CLAPTON

kabayiri wrote: »

Interesting.

I saw Cameron's speech as a very public challenge to the EU, and I'd be hoping for an European response which is equally open.

The 4 year period before being able to claim local benefits for example. That would of course be reciprocal, and apply to Britains working in France / Germany / Poland etc. Why would this be a difficult thing?

did he ask for a 4 year exclusion for local benefits?
what were his actual words?

chewmylegoff

It is totally unsurprising that there is nothing on free movement of people. All the important EU leaders (ie Merkel) have signalled very clearly that it is not up for debate and Cameron isn't stupid enough to set himself a goal which is unachievable; his position is that we should stay in as long as he gets "concessions".

So he will have a few dinners with other EU leaders and then claim victory as he has secured agreement on all four of these points which do not amount to anything new at all. For instance, we already have the leeway to place a residency qualification on all in work benefits which could be used to stop all migrants regardless of origin from claiming them for a period of the government's choosing.

wotsthat

kabayiri wrote: »

Interesting.

I saw Cameron's speech as a very public challenge to the EU, and I'd be hoping for an European response which is equally open.

The 4 year period before being able to claim local benefits for example. That would of course be reciprocal, and apply to Britains working in France / Germany / Poland etc. Why would this be a difficult thing?

I read somewhere that Cameron's demands might actually be quite easy for the EU to agree to but wouldn't be enough to convince the leave camp. Free movement was number 1, 2 and 3 on their list - without it being curtailed directly they don't need to change their minds - not that I think they would.

kabayiri

CLAPTON wrote: »

did he ask for a 4 year exclusion for local benefits?
what were his actual words?

“We have proposed that people coming to Britain from the EU must live here and contribute for four years before they qualify for in work benefits or social housing. And that we should end the practice of sending child benefit overseas. Now, I understand how difficult some of these welfare issues are for other Member States. And I am open to different ways of dealing with this issue."

...from Bloomberg.

The Child Benefit reform seems reasonable to me. I can see why someone would need to claim this if they brought their children over here when they came to work.

CLAPTON

kabayiri wrote: »

“We have proposed that people coming to Britain from the EU must live here and contribute for four years before they qualify for in work benefits or social housing. And that we should end the practice of sending child benefit overseas. Now, I understand how difficult some of these welfare issues are for other Member States. And I am open to different ways of dealing with this issue."

...from Bloomberg.

The Child Benefit reform seems reasonable to me. I can see why someone would need to claim this if they brought their children over here when they came to work.

'local benefit' and 'in work ' benefits


'social housing' ...how does that relate to housing benefits


'open to different ways of dealing with this issue'


sounds hollow to me.