PCN but parked in private compound

julienetmum

Hi,


I've been through the thread about how to appeal but I've just got a few questions about how to word things as the situation is slightly different.


My company are working on a hospital construction project. For the last few months the workmen have been driving through the hospital car park (pay and display) into the construction compound which isn't part of the pay & display car park (they have to go through a manned security barrier and sign in)


Half way through last month the hospital installed cameras on the entrance and exit to the hospital car park. The drivers did not notice this and when they went into the construction compound were not told about this by security until about a week later when they began to be asked to enter their registrations on an ipad. We are sending someone up there to check whether there is any signage in the compound and to take photographs.


The main contractors who we work for have no jurisdiction over the parking company (Civil Enforcement of Liverpool)


We now have two Parking Charge Notices and another sub contractor also has one. I actually think it doesn't comply with POFA as it was posted on 13th October, we received it on 15th October but the date we were parked was 16th & 17th September.


So I will obviously state this but do I also state in my letter that the circumstances (driver not parked in pay & display area but in a secure area not open to the public etc. or is that pointless as he should have seen the signs on entry to the hospital grounds?

Redx

just appeal them using the template letter as detailed in the Newbies sticky thread

also state that the drivers have to use the main entrance in order to access the construction car park and the signage and changes to the system were not adequate at the time which is mandatory in the BPA CoP when new conditions are introduced and that the system has to have time to "bed in"

also state that that POFA2012 has not been involved due to the notices arriving after 14 days (they appear to be using the 29 to 56 day rule but that is for windscreen ticket systems)

do not mention who was driving

if they fail to cancel, take the issues to popla , stating all the usual legal arguments

no contract
poor signage
BPA CoP failures
NTK flaws
POFA 2012 errors
not a gpeol (subject to the Beavis outcome this month or next month)

Herzlos

Check what the cameras are recording - one of them got into trouble as it was recording cars passing an access road. You should also be able to get whitelisted as you aren't using the car park they manage. I imagine you'd need to get the hospital to organize it.

In reality, they are not going to pursue this one beyond some harassment emails as your companies legal team will humiliate them in court.

They are BPA, so you should get a POPLA appeal if they refuse to play ball. I'd probably get your company rep to contact them to sort out a white list, and have someone appeal the existing tickets with a single point "The vehicle was not in a car park controlled by CEL".

ManxRed

The parking company doesn't have reasonable cause. These cars are only crossing the car park, not parking in it.

A stern complaint to the DVLA is in order.

julienetmum

This is all really helpful thanks.


My company doesn't have a legal team though! We are a small family run construction firm

julienetmum

We have absolutely no issue with being asked to enter our registrations on the ipads inside the compound now that we know about it.

Herzlos

Ah, though to be fair you're probably still better legally qualified than CEL, so don't worry about that. Have you got a solicitor?

Who contracted you? If it's the hospital, get them to sort something out.

In any case, complain to the DVLA and the BPA about the abuse (they've no right to request your details as you didn't use their car park), whilst making sure you appeal each invoice CEL send you.

If the hospital won't help, I'd get in touch with CEL direct and ask them to whitelist you as you will not be paying. You'll get on better if it's on solicitors headed paper - these guys are parasites that will likely cave as soon as they see a professional is involved.

DandelionPatrol

Signage is not relevant here. None of the 'overstay in a supermarket car park' arguments are relevant, nor any of the appeals processes. Parking within the compound is a right conferred on the main contractor by the contract. This may not be explicit, but it will be implicit in the contract.

A polite letter to the parking outfit is all that should be required, pointing out that the vehicles in question were parked in the compound.

julienetmum

The hospital engaged the main contractor C***** Health to run the project who then subcontracted ourseves and several others as specialist sub-contractors. We work for and are paid by C***** not the hospital.

Herzlos

Are C***** on-site as well, running the compound? Get them to sort it, as they will be having the same problems.

julienetmum

Yes they are on site running the compound. Our head engineer spoke to them and they said they have tried to sort it for someone else and failed.