Seller lied on property questionaire - Electrical fire

cattermole

sean1989 wrote: »

I would have paid for it, it was never offered so presumed i had paid for it in all the fees. I imagine that the conceyance services will have excuses upon excuses tomorrow

I would not phone them if you do anything put it in writing.

Davesnave

sean1989 wrote: »

I would have paid for it, it was never offered so presumed i had paid for it in all the fees. I imagine that the conceyance services will have excuses upon excuses tomorrow

I haven't read the entire thread, but I just want to point out that no one should presume anything when purchasing a house.

The conveyancer has certain checks and duties to perform, but they aren't all-knowing. The purchaser also has a duty to exercise due diligence. There are many extras that may be added to the basic survey and conveyance process, like an electrical check, and it's up to the purchaser to instruct with these.

Also, if the title plan doesn't accurately reflect the property offered for sale, how will the conveyancer realise this if the purchaser, who has seen the property, doesn't spot the error?

It's should always be a team effort.

skintandfat

It really comes down to proof, cable colours changed in 2004


Did the electrician who came take the cover off the shower?
The cable colour may be brown/blue


The previous owner may have changed the shower and left the existing wiring (then part P may not apply as it is a direct replacement; although the manufacturers instructions should have been adhered to)


I think it may be too late-it depends where you are in the UK (in Scotland you have only 5 working days to bring things to attention)

sean1989_2

skintandfat wrote: »

It really comes down to proof, cable colours changed in 2004


Did the electrician who came take the cover off the shower?
The cable colour may be brown/blue


The previous owner may have changed the shower and left the existing wiring (then part P may not apply as it is a direct replacement; although the manufacturers instructions should have been adhered to)


I think it may be too late-it depends where you are in the UK (in Scotland you have only 5 working days to bring things to attention)

I'm in mainland UK

Apparently you can still claim against the previous owners up to 15 years on from buying the house and some claims have been looked at that time! madness!

The electrician was only interested in stopping the house burning down from the CU - he dint touch anything else - the issue with the shower is the fact they rerouted the oven wires up to the isolation box controlling the shower - then purchased their own little fuse as in the pictures above that completely fried and melted

to be honest there is far more minor issues with the house as well - such as the flooding in the back garden - the leak from the bathroom to the kitchen (which was painted over) - damp in the extension and bedrooms ( which were painted over ) so i doubt the sellers had much integrity at all with all their little cover ups.

The main issue for me by far is the fact the electrics were botched. you can fix a bit of mould and a leak - but you cant bring someone back from the dead should it have happened and we never spotted it.

I will draft some complaint letters today and fire them off - i refuse to believe that people can just get away with this


EDIT - I have just been informed off my provider that when they came to fit a credit meter - the engineer reported a fault with the consumer unit and requested this to be looked into - Apparently this went under the radar and was never actioned on their end and they are "sorry" for this.....

AdrianC

sean1989 wrote: »

CU with scorch
imgur.com/aDtnqW4

So it's an utterly generic old (1970s/80s?) rewireable-fuse consumer unit with the fuse holders replaced with plug-in MCBs.

Damage to the shower 30A fuse
imgur.com/y5U4Hv5

That fuse holder - if it's got the right fuse wire in - should be more than adequate for more than 30A. Show me the other side - has it been rewired with the fuse wire doubled up? If not, then that's probably simply loose contacts in the CU's socket. What rating's the shower, and what rating's the shower's isolator?

When you say you're in "mainland UK" - are you in England/Wales, or are you in Scotland? The law on property purchasing differs markedly.

sean1989_2

AdrianC wrote: »

So it's an utterly generic old (1970s/80s?) rewireable-fuse consumer unit with the fuse holders replaced with plug-in MCBs.



That fuse holder - if it's got the right fuse wire in - should be more than adequate for more than 30A. Show me the other side - has it been rewired with the fuse wire doubled up? If not, then that's probably simply loose contacts in the CU's socket. What rating's the shower, and what rating's the shower's isolator?

When you say you're in "mainland UK" - are you in England/Wales, or are you in Scotland? The law on property purchasing differs markedly.

North west England

The other side of it is just casing that split - you can see a small 30amp fuse inside that you would normally see inside a plug socket. The prongs on this are literally held on by a thread - the move back and forward freely

The shower had been tapped into the cooker slot on the CU - this slot also ran the upstairs lights , - the whole CU had wires running here there an everywhere and quite frankly the only correct wiring was the main fuse into the house.

The shower is 8.5 KW

The electric board are coming out tonight - my supplier admitted there was a fault that was not actioned upon - yes i understand CU are property owners liability but god dammit - if an engineer fitting a credit meter says there's an issue with the CU - why does he not tell us - and why does the provider not action it! :mad:

AdrianC

sean1989 wrote: »

The shower is 8.5 KW

37A, then. So, yes, that "30A fuse" has probably been doubled-up with fuse wire, or 40A wire used.

The fuse you would normally see inside a plug (the socket is the bit on the wall) is 13A max.

SnooksNJ

sean1989 wrote: »

Thank you - someone that understands my point.

When they say "no" it means no...

Not "well we did but it was some cowboy that rigged our house to explode so im not telling you"

If you believe someone rigged your house to blow up with you and your partner in it maybe you contact the police.

AdrianC

SnooksNJ wrote: »

If you believe someone rigged your house to blow up with you and your partner in it...

...four months after moving in...

I suspect what's happened is that now the weather's turned cold, the shower's been turned up - or the incoming water is colder - and it's started to draw more current than the cabling could cope with. The previous owners probably didn't use the shower much, or had it lower than the OP does, so the problem-in-waiting just never manifested itself. The 30A fuse should have blown - and probably did in the past - so it's been bodged, removing the protection from the circuit.

All the clues were there from the start, though, and would have been obvious to a surveyor or even to a semi-clued-up layman. New 8.5kw shower, new kitchen, ancient CU... More investigation needed.

sean1989_2

AdrianC wrote: »

...four months after moving in...

I suspect what's happened is that now the weather's turned cold, the shower's been turned up - or the incoming water is colder - and it's started to draw more current than the cabling could cope with. The previous owners probably didn't use the shower much, or had it lower than the OP does, so the problem-in-waiting just never manifested itself. The 30A fuse should have blown - and probably did in the past - so it's been bodged, removing the protection from the circuit.

All the clues were there from the start, though, and would have been obvious to a surveyor or even to a semi-clued-up layman. New 8.5kw shower, new kitchen, ancient CU... More investigation needed.

I respect this - but remember - the sellers marked "no" to any electrical amendments in the property - this is what my OP is about.

The fact they marked "no" is a deliberate lie and this is what my case will be built around.

Had this said "yes" then im sure the solicitor would have advised for further testing and even i would have kicked and screamed about it - ultimately then probably leading to me not completing the purchase.

Sellers need to be aware that these forms are obviously relied upon and lying on them will not result in a positive outcome for anyone.

A formal complaint is now sent to the conveyancers who are shocked and appalled that this has slipped through their hands.

Already they have expressed their concerns in the solicitor "missing" the "no" to amendments but marking "to follow"

To be clear- Had it said "yes" changes were made and a survey brought back these issues - this house would still be up for sale