PCN Notice Greenford / otter road yellow box

Edwood_Woodwood

wealdroam wrote: »

, the OP should not be entering the box anticipating that vehicles that are still in the box will have left it, and left enough room for him, by the time he gets there.
:

No, that is not the offence.

So long as you have entered the box and the vehicle/s in front are moving then it is no offence if you subsequently have to stop in the box.

It would be had you entered the box whilst the vehicle/s in front were already stationary.

Big difference.

AdrianC

Edwood_Woodwood wrote: »

When the OP entered the box, the vehicle in front of him, and beside, was moving.

He did not enter the box with a stationary vehicle already blocking his exit.

When the van did eventually become stationary the OP had to stop, in the box.

Was his exit clear?

wealdroam

Edwood_Woodwood wrote: »

I would liken it to passing the stop line of traffic lights on green at a junction, waiting in the middle of the road, wishing to turn right.

And in the case of box junctions there is an exception on turning right.

Is there perhaps anything else, other than turning right, that you could liken it to?

Edwood_Woodwood

AdrianC wrote: »

Was his exit clear?

Yes it was, and the footage proves it. A white van proves it.

It matters not that the OP then had to stop in the box.

The white van wasn't already blocking the exit when the OP entered the box. They were both moving vehicles.

That is the test for this offence, not just stopping in a box, period.

Otherwise the Act would simply say so.

edit-Not to even mention the other lane being clear too.

Edwood_Woodwood

wealdroam wrote: »

And in the case of box junctions there is an exception on turning right.

You are talking of an exception.

Turning right at traffic lights in the way I described isn't.

It's the perfectly legal thing to do, as is entering a box junction with moving traffic and then stopping in it if need be.

Show me the Act where it just says stopping in a box junction is an offence.

AdrianC

Edwood_Woodwood wrote: »

Yes it was, and the footage proves it.

Nope. It proves the exact opposite.

His exit was NOT clear when he entered - because there was a van between him and it. The van then stopped just outside the box, leaving him in the box without any clear exit.

Edwood_Woodwood

AdrianC wrote: »

Nope. It proves the exact opposite.

His exit was NOT clear when he entered - because there was a van between him and it. The van then stopped just outside the box,

A-ha! Got you!

Then you admit the van had to stop, it had not already stopped?

It was obviously moving?

It was not already blocking the exit, it was not stationary?

Entering a box junction whilst the traffic in front of you is moving, then stopping in the box junction because you are unable to exit, is, I repeat, not an offence.

Entering the box if the van was already stationary beyond the box, would be an offence.

Big difference.

Edwood_Woodwood

Again, show me the Act where it simply says stopping in a box junction is an offence.

I'm waiting.

AdrianC

Edwood_Woodwood wrote: »

Then you admit the van had to stop, it had not already stopped?

Umm, yes. A quick glance at the video shows that. Denial of reality is your department.

Look, it's very simple... If HIS EXIT was clear when he pulled into the box, why did he have to stop in it? Simple. Because HIS EXIT - not the van's exit - was not clear. There was a van in it. The van's exit was clear, and the van cleared the box. The OP's exit was not clear, so the OP could not clear it.

Edwood_Woodwood

AdrianC wrote: »

Umm, yes. A quick glance at the video shows that. Denial of reality is your department.

Look, it's very simple... If HIS EXIT was clear when he pulled into the box, why did he have to stop in it? Simple. Because HIS EXIT - not the van's exit - was not clear. There was a van in it. The van's exit was clear, and the van cleared the box. The OP's exit was not clear, so the OP could not clear it.

Please, please...

Look, just google this offence and all will be revealed for you.

What you state above is not the test for the offence!

The offence is entering the box whilst the exit is already blocked, with stationary traffic.

This circumstance shows the exit became blocked after entering the box, regardless if he could fit in or not.

That is not an offence.