Aiming for Oxford/Cambridge universities for my daughter

Newly_retired

Both my children actually decided not to go to university straight from school.

One did his degree p/t whilst working, with the support of his employer, the other changed her career path in her twenties and went as a f/t mature student.
Both achieved good careers.
There are many routes possible in life.

FBaby

I can honestly say that if mum hadn't pushed me into doing lots of outside activities and bribed me into getting good grades, I wouldn't be where I am today. There may have been pressure on me, but as a child, I didn't see it. There's a balance to be achieved between being encouraging and being overbearing. It can be done, and to great effect.

You raise a very good point. Pushing children has become a very unpopular approach which seems to be automatically linked with stressed kids. I am not sure that is always the case at all and watching the programme 'child genius' (or something like that) was a real eye opener. It showed the life of some of the cleverest 12yo in the country, and the difference in the environment they were growing up was very different. You had those with the extreme pushy parents, but interestingly, the child were this was more blatant didn't seem one bit bothered about it, on the contrary, he was himself very ambitious and determined and seemed grateful for his dad to be like this. There was clearly a lot of love and respect between them. You then had the child who put himself through the whole things against his parents' advice. They openly said they didn't think he was clever 'enough' but would support the child. Their relationship was also very loving and supportive.

I really don't think that parental pressure is always a bad thing, and it mainly depend on the child. Some are naturally much more resilient, whilst others will fall apart at the slightest pressure. My DD is naturally very ambitious and a totally non-stressed kid. She actually said to be that she loves exams because it pushes her ability. She never get stressed about them even though she is under huge pressure since she has high aspirations which means that she does need to get top grades.

bouicca21

I second the difference between encouraging and overbearing. When mine were young we were hard up and living in relatively poor area. I was horrified at the limited horizons of most of the other parents and children, and certainly made it my business to encourage my children to be aspirational. Not aspirational in terms of setting specific goals, but aspirational in the sense of knowing that there are a lot of choices out there, and you want to be equipped to take advantage of them.

gettingtheresometime

Another thing to bear in mind (and I think I'm right in saying this but willing to be told I'm wrong) is that Oxbridge don't allow their students to work during term time.

Obviously this has cost implications

tbh I don't think there has been inverted snobbery demonstrated on this thread. I think its just been pointed out to the OP that Oxbridge is not the be all and end all of Universities and that at the end of the day its the daughter's choice.

I used to hate it when children as young as 11 would say to me that they couldn't do x y or z just because of where they went to school - it was almost as if they had had it drummed into them that they weren't capable of achieving things just because of where they went to school

susancs

OP, I know from DD that in her secondary school, they actually sought out children who might be suitable for Oxbridge entry and supported them through the entry process. They spoke to the parents at consultation evening, after already having spoken to the students. All the students concerned had top grades at GCSE in all subjects and were predicted A* grades in A level in traditional subjects, plus wanted to do a more traditional degree subject.

It really came down to the interview for the five students that went for Oxbridge and perfromance in that. The lad who actually had the highest number of A* GCSE grades and was doing 5 A levels was not offered a place at Cambridge. When he got feedback later it was because he looked at one of the interviewers on a couple of occassions for consolidation after answering a question! Having said that he was not bothered as he liked another Uni better for his Physics degree. I understand the package at Cambridge was more money saving as it included meals, laundry etc.

A quirky lad who has autism got an offer for English at Oxford, when he apparently spent the interview arguing with the panel about how much he disliked Beatrix Potter as a writer. he was very surprised to be offered a place.

The Head Boy at the school got an offer for Geography at Cambridge. His main paid job was tutoring GCSE students. He also had been to a leper village in India (schools main charity) and done a huge amount of fundraising activities for them, including arranging Indian themed dinner nights, sponsorship deals, arranging donations and getting them sent out etc. He had also arranged AS and A2 biology and geography revision sessions fo all the students. One of his A levels was in Latin and the school did not offer Latin, so he was self taught.

Another maths student got an offer at Oxford, but again he did a lot of tutoring of other GCSE students on a paid basis. He had led the school rugby team to a lot of wins against other schools and had done fund raising to improve a local rugby club building to enable it to be used by the local community. He also had done the Nuffield Foundation research programme over the summer in a maths related field. Another maths student got offered a place there also, but turned it down in favour of an unconditional offer at another uni if he put it as his firm choice (plus although he did not need any A level grades to get the place, they offered him £3k for each A* grade he got at a level).

OP, the young people who got offered the places were all naturally driven students, who liked to make a difference in the lives of others and who also were very nice people. I know most of their parents and they were quite easy going people who just supported what their child wanted to do. Another thing to consider OP, is that Oxbridge may not offer a course that suits your child, for example my DD wanted to do a masters in Pharmacy. Another thing to consider si that they may not liked the Uni when visting, as my DD turned down a place at the Uni with the top results in pharmacy for another Uni she liked better.

onlyroz

gettingtheresometime wrote: »

Another thing to bear in mind (and I think I'm right in saying this but willing to be told I'm wrong) is that Oxbridge don't allow their students to work during term time.

That's true, but the terms are much shorter (around 8 weeks I think) and so there is a greater opportunity to work during the holidays.

ashtray_heart

You aren't allowed to work in term time and to be honest you get so much work set that during the holidays you still need to study. However there are loads of bursaries available so that if money is an issue you don't need to work. You can have jobs like working in the college bar or library.

merrydance

We are a "working-class" family and my son went to the local comprehensive school. He did not get straight A's at GCSE level ( a lot due to peer pressure, as he did not want to appear too geeky) however he got A's in his A levels. He also took extra Maths exams, I can't remember what they are called but begin with the letter S. He took these especially to get an interview at Oxbridge. He had many more opportunities there than my daughter who went to another uni. (She actually got higher grades than him in GCSES and the same grades at A level) He went on an exchange course at MIT and Harvard and made many friends. He also got the opportunity to go to Zambia, Nepal and Israel. He also seemed to have more one to one tutouring. He now has a good job. I think he felt a lot of the other students where a bit "posh" but he knows it was a great privilege to go there. It didn't even enter his head until sixth form to apply there.

southoftheriver

My fiance turned down a place at Oxford because he didn't feel the course was right for him at the age of 18. He went to York instead. He did however go to Cambridge for his masters. All of the decisions he made were his own and I'm so proud that he had the strength to make decisions that were right for him. He also has amazing parents who encouraged him to follow his own path.

I'm from a very working class background and didn't go to Oxbridge, but did study a very prestigious degree. Again, the driving force was me, not pressure from my parents or anyone else.

If your daughter is bright then trust her to make her own decisions with your support.

LannieDuck

I went to Oxford. I had an absolutely wonderful time and loved my university years.

I've always been very academic and enjoyed school. Oxford surrounded me with like-minded people. It wasn't all-study-all-the-time, but everyone did generally get their work done on time, and lectures were well attended. It's basically full of people who are able to motivate themselves to learn.

jaylee3 wrote: »

I admire your ambition OP, but I wouldn't count on getting your daughter in. They are generally looking for either people from a 'upper middle class' or 'upper class' family, often with contacts and influence, OR they have to be be outstanding, and have a clean sweep of A* in GCSE and also A levels.

You definitely need mostly As and occasional Bs at A-level, and I think you'd be expected to have mostly As and A*s at GCSE.

jaylee3 wrote: »

I know a couple of people who know people in Oxford, and they said the students are constantly under stress to achieve high, failure is not an option

This isn't true at all. The general expectation is that you will produce good-quality work, but I didn't see that as 'under stress' so much as 'encouraging success'.

jaylee3 wrote: »

the students there suffer from stress and depression more than any other students at any other university. (Not sure about Cambridge, but I can imagine that may be the same..)

I've heard that before and I'm not sure what the stats are. But my OH (also went to Oxford) has said that some of his friends found it hard to go from being the highest achiever in their school to being just middle-of-the-pack. I think this depends on whether you've been bought up to always be told you're the best at everything.

jaylee3 wrote: »

Also, there is an elitist attitude there, and your daughter may find it hard to fit in if she is not from the same background as the majority.

lol, this is so untrue it's funny. There might be an elitist attitude at some of the older, more traditional colleges, but it definitely wasn't true at mine. I'm trying to remember which of my university friends went to private school. I'm pretty sure some of them did, but I can't remember which. It just wasn't important.

jaylee3 wrote: »

Thing is, does SHE want to go? Or is it more about you saying 'my daughter goes to Oxford?!'

This bit I do agree with. You need to be self-motivated to enjoy your time at Oxford, and you need to love your subject.

If your daughter wants to go there, I would encourage it, but encourage other places too because the admissions process can be a bit hit-and-miss. The most academic don't always get in - tutors like a well-rounded applicant. So encourage her, but don't build it up so much that she's devastated to go elsewhere.

...and Yr 9 is a bit early to start thinking about it. When she's doing her A-levels would be the right time to start considering whether she'll get the qualifications to apply.