Heating system for house with no gas

captainhindsight_2

lovesgshp wrote: »

I do not know if you are referring to me as a scourge on mse, but let me give you some facts.
I work with a geothermal company in Italy, that has been established since 1999 and only deals with geothermal type installations. No gas, pellets etc, just GSHP, Air/Water and Air/Air. I have worked with them for about 10 years now, so probably know a little of what I am talking about.
The senior engineer/ owner of the company is fully certified and has to attend refresher courses every 2 years, to continue certification for the following:
US IGSHPA Accredited Installer
US AEE Certified Geoexchange Designer

He also writes papers for different conferences, which you can have a look at, which show problems, options for solutions etc. Just open the PDF file links.
http://www.geotherm.it/Ricerca_scientifica_geotermia.html

So you have a vested interest which apparently discredits any one from commenting about anything on Mse.

lovesgshp

My interest is helping people that have maybe poor installations in the UK, as we do not have any presence there at all and I do it as a favour to try and help out.
If you have a GSHP, then you could possibly help out on the GSHP sticky thread on the forum, where people have posted problems.
I do not charge anyone in the UK the Euro 40 per hour that I get paid over here for advice, even with some of my clients.
I am quite happy to help anyone out in the UK if I can.

Oakgreen

I have ASHP and gas boiler fitted, the house is a 3 bed detached, about 10 years old - it worked out cheaper to install than replacing the boiler entirely (no need to remove boiler or change radiators etc) and still receive RHI payments. Its been in for over a year and so far running costs and COP are good and the house is warm. Whole house electricity usage was 3785kWh last year with gas at 278kWh (boiler hardly ever runs). Would definitely recommend this combination it is saving compared the cost of running the gas boiler alone in 2013 - I am sure it would work well with other types of boiler as well - if budget doesn't stretch to having 2 heat sources then out of the original options then I would say oil is the best bet, at current prices at least.

Richie-from-the-Boro

SWenergy wrote: »

heat pumps are an extremely viable option they are around 50% cheaper to run compared to oil and the RHI will give you quarterly payments for 7 years that will cover the cost of the install. i would suggest looking into them further

- 5 posts all flogging an individual company and a heat pumps
- spam elsewhere my friend
- you are gone .................

Cardew

SWenergy wrote: »

i am merely spending my time attempting to advise and educate, as many people are ill informed on heat pump technology.

No you are not - you are simply trying to 'push' the technology with un-substantiated claims.


You have also been told you cannot use your firm's name. That is why your previous posts have been removed.

jillard-house

as much as i disagree with a company using this site for marketing purposes. the claims made were true

Cardew

jillard-house wrote: »

as much as i disagree with a company using this site for marketing purposes. the claims made were true

Welcome to the forum.


You joined today, and the posts by xxxx were deleted. Would you be from the same firm?


So what claims(plural) did he make? and please substantiate those claims.

jillard-house

well thank you for being so accommodating,

and i had a heat pump installed last year, i was on oil before and my bills went from £1300 to £700 which is about 50% also i'm getting £30,000 of RHI payments

i do not wish to create dispute however i felt as if i should shed some light on the situation

zeupater

jillard-house wrote: »

well thank you for being so accommodating,

and i had a heat pump installed last year, i was on oil before and my bills went from £1300 to £700 which is about 50% also i'm getting £30,000 of RHI payments

i do not wish to create dispute however i felt as if i should shed some light on the situation

Hi

That seems to be interesting .... £1300/year on oil equating to almost £4300/year from RHI ?

Surely on a legacy ASHP £4300 equates to almost 60,000kWh.t of deemed annual heat provision, which would require somewhere around 6000litres of oil (after considering boiler efficiencies), which would currently cost around £2400/year (40p/litre) and probably considerably more before last year ....

Come at it from the opposite direction, to provide 60,000kWh.t of heat via a heat-pump using electricity at (say) 14p/kWh and assuming that the only electric appliance ever used in the house was the heat-pump (as-if!) and even assuming that there wasn't a standing charge then you're using 5000kWh of electricity (700/.14) to provide 60000kWh.t of heat, representing a SCOP of 12 (60/5) ....

Now, on another thread I recently posted the following in answer to a new member who seems to have had some posts removed by admin ....

zeupater wrote: »

....
Looking at the market, the issue with both heat-pumps and biomass boiler is that margin expectations of both manufacturers and installers is holding back sector growth ... a GCH boiler costing ~£800/£1000 can be supplied & installed for ~£2k, so installation and margin equates to ~£1k .... the question therefore remains as to why an ASHP retailing at ~£2.5k costs over £5k to install, something which becomes far more interesting when almost exactly the same technology is used in Air/Air heat-pumps of similar capacity which can be supplied & installed for around the same cost as a GCH boiler ...

There are a number of members of this forum who try to ensure that people aren't as "ill informed on heat pump technology" as many industry insiders would hope - this includes a number of heat-pump engineers, some posting from countries with far more HP experience than the UK. As long as there's not an intent to represent a particular commercial interest and advice given stands up to the normal (high) level of scrutiny, you'll find that this community would readily welcome another industry insider, the alternative usually results in a pretty rough ride ...

... following on from that the question must be asked as to whether anyone looking to make a heat-source decision based on the above-referenced information (£1300/£700/£30000) would be classified as having been 'ill-informed' ?

HTH
Z

Cardew

jillard-house wrote: »

well thank you for being so accommodating,

and i had a heat pump installed last year, i was on oil before and my bills went from £1300 to £700 which is about 50% also i'm getting £30,000 of RHI payments

i do not wish to create dispute however i felt as if i should shed some light on the situation

Dispute or not, your claim sheds no light on the situation, and as shown in the post above by zeupater(in his usual polite manner) the claim is unsupportable.

I posted the following in response to xxxx's claim that a heat pump is 50% cheaper to run than oil.

Your claim that heat pumps are 50% cheaper to run than oil is a nonsense.


Oil is currently around 32pence a litre. A litre contains 10.2kWh. So the price per kWh is approx. 3.2p. Then take into account the efficiency of the boiler which can be 90%. However taking it as, say, 80% that gives a price of 4p/kWh.


The energy saving trust(EST) carried our a 2 year trial of air source heat pumps The average system COP achieved was 2.45. Taking electricity at 12p/kWh the cost is 4.9p/kWh. so not 50% cheaper but 22% more expensive.


Then you need to take into account that a heat pump has to run very long hours - even 24/7 to be effective. So if you are out during the day, and at night when you are in bed, the heat pump is running and wasting heat. With oil/gas CH the boiler can be set to come on, say, 20 mins before you get in after work or get up in the morning.


On RHI you neglect to mention the criteria necessary to qualify for payment.

As you ascertain that a heat pump is 50% cheaper to run than oil CH, there must be serious flaws in my figures and those of zeupater. Can you please explain where we have got it wrong.