Selling Dad's Property

p00hsticks

Beancounter wrote: »

We were discussing the unfairness of the system last night with dads neighbours where a man works hard all his life to buy his own property, hoping he can leave everything for family then still has to pay for a care home at the end of his life and then there's the scroungers who live on the state all thier lives and then will get this care free at the end too.

It's so unfair really. The law is the law though.

Your fathers savings will buy him choice as to how he is cared for and if/when or where he goes into a care home.

Not everyone with less than around £20k is a 'scrounger' - ther are many who have worked alll their lives for little more than minimum wage and so never benefited from owning their own property, and by the time they may need care in their late 80's or 90s have exhausted any savings they may have had.

If his family wish to inherit 'everything' then this can be achieved by caring for their relatives themselves - the more care they provide themselves, the less will need to be paid for from their potential inheritance.

Mojisola

Beancounter wrote: »

Quite a stark statistic that the average stay in a care home i less than 2 years.:(

That's an average - some people go into care because of health emergencies and only live a few months so that keeps the average length of stay short.

p00hsticks

Beancounter wrote: »

My point here was he has been on a modest wage all his working life and decided not to rely on the council for housing and sacrificed a lot to buy his own modest little flat yet gets penalised at the end of his life.

But he's not getting "penalised", is he ? His "sacrifice" means that if he does have to go into care, he will have choices about how and where that care is provided that those who dont have that resource for whatever reason simply won't have.

And if he doesn't have to go into care for any length of time (which the minority of the elderly don't), then there will be something his family can inherit.

In your shoes I'd be thanking my lucky stars he has some capital

AdrianC

Beancounter wrote: »

Not sure if you were having a pop at me there but...

I was pointing out the other side of that "unfairness".

The flat my Dad has is very modest, it will barely cover fees for 3 years I would think, we are not talking hundreds of thousands of pounds here.

That's still three years and many tens of thousands of pounds that would otherwise have to come from additional taxes or reduced council spending on other things. And the only difference, at the end of the day, would be that your father's money would be left in his will.

I couldn't care less about any inheritance, as already stated I just want dad to be comfortable for the rest of his life.

Then, surely, it should be a no-brainer that your father's assets should be used for his care, allowing you/him to choose where he spends the last chapter of his life, rather than having the council appoint the cheapest industrial-scale battery-farm?

Beancounter

Ok, final post on this matter, I'm getting a bit upset.

Let's suppose he does have to go into residential care, burns through the 3 years of house sale proceeds (he has not got a penny of savings by the way). What happens then? Do the LA pick up the tab, is it down to us to pay or is he moved to the "cheapest industrial-scale battery-farm" AdrianC describes?

Mojisola

Beancounter wrote: »

The flat my Dad has is very modest, it will barely cover fees for 3 years I would think, we are not talking hundreds of thousands of pounds here.

My point here was he has been on a modest wage all his working life and decided not to rely on the council for housing and sacrificed a lot to buy his own modest little flat yet gets penalised at the end of his life.

I couldn't care less about any inheritance, as already stated I just want dad to be comfortable for the rest of his life.

A lot of parents do hope to leave their children an inheritance and I'm sure he would like you to have something after he dies but he will have benefited from buying his council flat cheaper than on the open market and will also have seen the value of the flat rise just because of the changes in house prices so has gained in those ways.

My Dad was able to pay his care home fees just because the family house had risen so much in value - if it had stayed around the price they paid for it, he would have been funded by the council.

Have a look at the AgeUK leaflets about paying for care and the financial assessment.

If he buys a funeral plan, that isn't counted in the financial assessment so that the money he leaves will go to his children rather than be used to pay for the funeral.

Mojisola

Beancounter wrote: »

Ok, final post on this matter, I'm getting a bit upset.

Let's suppose he does have to go into residential care, burns through the 3 years of house sale proceeds (he has not got a penny of savings by the way). What happens then? Do the LA pick up the tab, is it down to us to pay or is he moved to the "cheapest industrial-scale battery-farm" AdrianC describes?

Try not to get upset - it's very difficult helping parents when they get frail and it's not easy to find your way through all the legal and financial stuff.

If your father does need residential care, starts out by paying for himself and then reaches the level where he is entitled to assistance, the local authority will step in.

If you can show that he would be badly affected by changing homes, the LA would have to keep him in his chosen home. They will try to get someone else (usually a relative) to sign up to pay 'top-up fees' - don't do this without taking advice.

It's worth finding a mid-range home so that the money lasts as long as possible. We visited several - in fact, my Dad wouldn't have been at home in the expensive, 5* hotel ones and we chose one that concentrated on staff rather than show and he was very happy there.

Sunnyweather

TBH I looked after mine at home. Each to their own. Don't like homes.

p00hsticks

Beancounter wrote: »

Ok, final post on this matter, I'm getting a bit upset.

Let's suppose he does have to go into residential care, burns through the 3 years of house sale proceeds (he has not got a penny of savings by the way). What happens then? Do the LA pick up the tab, is it down to us to pay or is he moved to the "cheapest industrial-scale battery-farm" AdrianC describes?

I believe there are major changes on the way, but my current understanding is that at the point he would need to go into a home he will be means tested by the local council to work out how much he can contribute to the costs of home, and that will determine the choice of homes offered. If a third party (i.e the relatives) can act as guarantors for any future shortfal lthen a wider choice of homes will be available.

I suggest you look at the age.uk website which has much useful information on the subject

http://www.ageuk.org.uk/home-and-care/care-homes/

I apologies if anything I've posted has upset you - that was certainly not my intent. But I'm in a very similar position to yourself, except with an elderly very frail Mother-in-law who worked all her life for low wages and at 88 has no savings or assets. Trust me when I say that from my research, the fact that your father will be able to generate some money from the sale of his home can only make his final days more comfortable, not less.

p00hsticks

Sunnyweather wrote: »

TBH I looked after mine at home. Each to their own. Don't like homes.

May I ask how you managed that financially ? I'm aware of attendance allowance ,carers allowance and housing benefit, and my MIL gets' state pension, but if I gave up work to be a full time carer it would result in a very big drop in income for, that I'm not sure we could manage ....