Marriage Problems - Potential Split

Jonny1978

Hi,


I'll try to keep this brief but will be hard. I've been married to my wife 5 years and we've been together 15 years and we have two DS's (4 & 1). The relationship has been rocky for a long time and from my point of view (and I accept this isn't the only one) I've felt like whatever I do cannot make my wife happy for a long time. She finds fault in the smallest thing I do/don't do, always manages to find a negative or put the dampeners on things I try to arrange for us or want to do myself and has a short temper so flies off the handle a lot. I've lived with this for a long time, that's been my choice, but something has changed recently.


I don't know if its the arrival of our youngest, a recent house move or just my patience wearing down but I don't think I can live like this anymore. I just want a quiet, peaceful life and I'm sick of living in a house which regularly descends into chaos when she starts screaming and shouting at me (usually) or the kids (sometimes) about something minor which has annoyed her. She isn't a bad person, is a good mother and i'll admit pretty much runs he house as I work full time and she works part time. I try to do my bit house wise but she'll only let me do certain things as "I wont do it properly" but then accuses me of doing nothing which isn't true.


But that's not the heart of it I'm sure, can housework be that important? At the heart of it she just seems really angry and unhappy and I am the focus of everything. So I've suggested separating, if for no other reason than it may produce a better, calmer home environment for our boys and they can come and spend time with me wherever I move to. Her initial reaction to this (in a temper) was "go on then - f*** o**". On further discussion she said I might as well go as I make her unhappy(not I don't make her happy - I actually make her unhappy). So I suggested I would look into renting somewhere and would make sure I pay my half of the mortgage plus whatever the government says I should in CM. I also want to discuss access every other weekend and overnight through the week but that's still to come... Her response to this was, "you'll pay more than the government says, our lifestyle isn't suffering because you've moved out" - not a good start.


If we are going to do this, and I'm starting to think it's for the best, then I really, really want it to be amicable for everybody's sake. I've just got an awful feeling that's going to be difficult. Having said all that, this situation is my fault as much as anyone's. I've known what she's like for years, I've chosen to go along and put up with it. I've even allowed myself to be talked into moving to a bigger newer house as I thought the old house was part of what was making her unhappy (as she always moaned about it) - sticking my head in the sand I know...


Not sure what I'm looking for on here, just a chance to vent as I don't do that much in the real world I suppose....


Thanks

BigAunty

1. check out the Shelter website relationship breakdown section to understand your rights and options with regard to the property. It's a housing advice charity. Is the property jointly owned?

2. check out the Direct Gov website Child Maintenance information - they have a handy calculator there. Also, there is a child support forum here on MSE.

https://www.gov.uk/how-child-maintenance-is-worked-out/overview

I think the sum expected from a non-resident parent for 2 children is 20% of their net weekly income but there are many factors that can change this rule of thumb.

3. Have a browse of websites devoted to domestic abuse experienced by male partners to get some idea of whether you have been a victim and whether their support would help. DA isn't just about physical violence, it is about a pattern of disrespectful behaviour, verbal abuse, pressure tactics, emotional abuse and so forth.

4. See a solicitor and read up about divorce and divorce settlements, child acces, etc, to get an idea of what will happen if your separation becomes formalised.

5. Have you considered suggesting couples counselling to her?

6. enter the lone parent scenario from her perspective into the Turn2us online benefit calculator. you may be surprised about the benefits she may be due - income support of around £70 a week, working tax credits (if she works a minimum of 16 hours per week) and child tax credits, child benefit.

If she is low waged, she might get £100 plus from employment, plus £300 or more in child related/working tax credits per week for example with virtually no council tax to pay. The child support that you must pay is received on top of her benefits without affecting it.

Come back to the forum if you wish and detail her income before/after the separation.

Consider the entire financial picture rather than be subject to her demands and guilt trips, get expert legal advice, don't make rash offers without working out your rights and obligations.



On the subject of her 'lifestyle' demands, you don't 'have' to pay half the mortgage - it's something you can come to an agreement with your ex as part of the divorce settlement.

Sometimes a court can give an occupancy order giving the parent with care of the children the right to occupy the family home until the youngest turns 18 and then it is sold. Sometimes the court expects the resident parent to pay the mortage and for the equity to be split upon the sale of it. Ask on the housing forum of some likely options.

ALI1973

You both sound very sad and possibly a bit depressed?

I think most people have thought at some time that moving house, having a baby etc will make them feel happier, and sadly even when they get their wish, the unhappiness stays.

I think you should seek a good marriage counsellor in the first instance to see if you can get to the real reason you are both so unhappy. And also maybe you could both approach the doctor to discuss possible depression?

It maybe that once the root cause is found that you will discover a better way to be a couple/family?

You mention that although your wife works part-time (and probably does the lions share of the childcare?) that she also pretty much handles all the house, you could begin with trying to unburden some of this from her shoulders. I know I appreciate my DH far more when he just gets on does things that he can see need doing, rather than waiting to be asked to do them iyswim? - he may not do them the way I prefer, but I appreciate the effort (as long as I don't have to do it all again!). Do you still love her? if so, tell her! - if you want your marriage to work, tell her! and if you can't talk then write it down.

It is hard work to make a marriage work and it requires daily attention, but I am sure, will be all the more rewarding for you all in the long run.

Of course it will always be your choice. I wish you and your family the very best wishes.

z.n

My first thought was check for PND. It can be low-lying and hang around for ages. Keeping it 'controlled' can be utterly exhausting- causing a constant feeling of being overwhelmed and unsupported.

Jonny1978

Hi,


Thanks everyone. In response to some of the points raised:


Child Maintenance Calculator - I've used this and it says I should pay £420/month if I have the boys 2-3 nights per week which is what I want. This wont be welcome surprise as I think she will expect more, I was intending on paying £500 anyway as don't want casting as a neglectful/bad father.


PND/Depression/Counselling - We've discussed counselling when we've had issues in the past and I'd be willing but she flat refuses, I just need to change and stop winding her up. I've wondered about depression and PND but there is no way I could get her to consider it let alone visit a doctors. As for me being depressed I think I am fairly resilient but have been down about our situation for a while. At work and with friends though I'm happy enough and would be seen as a pretty positive person.


Solicitors - Don't want to go down this route yet. If we are to split I want to get things settled for everyone and we can deal with the divorce and solicitors later. I will consult on here and read up to make sure I know my rights though.


Housework - There are things I do automatically like my own ironing. cooking for the kids, washing/drying up, wiping work surfaces. Other stuff I do when asked but then get abuse for not meeting her exacting standards as she's so obsessive about things. I also do DIY stuff when needed although again she tends not to be happy with the job I do.


Benefits - I visited the website and used the calculator and was amazed at how much she me be entitled to if we split. Wouldn't mind someone checking this so details needed below:


Gross Salary: £17,500
Hours/WK - 22
Childcare Costs (I currently pay) - £200/month
Council Tax Band: E


Thanks for all your replies...

FBaby

Other stuff I do when asked but then get abuse for not meeting her exacting standards as she's so obsessive about things

You say that she is often angry and aggrevated because of things you do/don't do? What are these? To be fair, I've had friends with similar complaints about their husband, and I thought it was very justified, but at other times, I think some women working part-time expect their husband working full-time to put as much in in no more than themselves, even with children at nursery/school.

ALI1973

Jonny1978 wrote: »

PND/Depression/Counselling - We've discussed counselling when we've had issues in the past and I'd be willing but she flat refuses, I just need to change and stop winding her up. I've wondered about depression and PND but there is no way I could get her to consider it let alone visit a doctors. As for me being depressed I think I am fairly resilient but have been down about our situation for a while. At work and with friends though I'm happy enough and would be seen as a pretty positive person.

Housework - There are things I do automatically like my own ironing. cooking for the kids, washing/drying up, wiping work surfaces. Other stuff I do when asked but then get abuse for not meeting her exacting standards as she's so obsessive* about things. I also do DIY stuff when needed although again she tends not to be happy with the job I do.
.

Go alone then to both the Doctor and the Counsellor, if she sees something positive/active from you it may just prompt her to take action herself. She may need to "see" that you want to fight for the relationship? (I have done and would go alone again, it is really helpful to be able to discuss honestly how you feel and gain some perspective on it)

*TBH, I can be like this, and the more stressed/anxious I am the worse it gets. BUT, if DH does things without being asked I am less likely to feel grumpy if it's not done exactly how I like. If I have had to ask him to do something (especially if he knows I like it done a certain way) and he doesn't then I do feel really cross.

Being really truthful, I find it really wearing that my DH needs to be told to do things, especially as I see us as an equal partnership, both responsible for everything. The fact that I have "obsessions" is because I have had sole responsibility for them. I expect to tell/show the children how to do things not another adult, if you can see where I am coming from?

It does seem though that you are determined to leave rather than try and save your marriage.

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

Would she not allow you to do all the ironing or cook for both of you? Or have you considered doing the washing, pushing the vacuum cleaner around whilst she sits down with a cuppa you made for her, loading the dishwasher, etc?

I sometimes feel a bit 'hmmmph' about the boyfriend putting his washing away, but it not occurring to him that he may as well put everything else away at the same time. In fairness, he's lovely, and will do anything I ask him to do - but I do have to ask him in the first place, he doesn't realise that it would be nice if I didn't have to think of it in the first place. That and I don't see giving him a list of tasks to do/orders to follow as treating him as a fully grown man.


Does she want or need time away from the children just for herself? If she feels like she's doing it all on her own, that could foster resentment to the extent that she thinks she's doing it all herself anyway, and you're making extra work.


It might be beyond recovery, but maybe even trying now might make a future split more amicable. And paying your legal required amount would leave you extra to help as and when needed, especially as you need to provide a place for your children to be comfortable when staying. On the positive side, staying contact would also give her time when she doesn't has to do anything related to children or home.

TBagpuss

if you feel that separation is the way forward, I very strongly recommend that you go and see a solicitor sooner rather than later. Just seeing a solicitor doesn't mean you have to start a legal fight, or start divorce proceedings, but you do need to have a clear idea ofwhat your options re, and what might work longer term.

If you try to 'get things settled' without first getting some proper advice then the risk is that you may end up taking steps, or agreeing to things which you cannot maintain longer term, or which seriously disadvantage you.

Unless you have a lot of surplus income, then it is unrealistic of either of you to think you will be able to separate and to maintain the same standard of living - you simply cannot run two homes for the price of one.

Of course, if the two of you can agree things between yourselves that it by far the best way, but until you know where you stand, and what your options are, and what you and she are likely to be entitled to, it is very difficult for you to make a realistic judgment about what you can, or would propose or agree to.

Mojisola

ALI1973 wrote: »

Go alone then to both the Doctor and the Counsellor, if she sees something positive/active from you it may just prompt her to take action herself. She may need to "see" that you want to fight for the relationship? (I have done and would go alone again, it is really helpful to be able to discuss honestly how you feel and gain some perspective on it)

I would try this as a last ditch effort so that you know that you've tried everything before making the split final.

If you do split, TBagpuss has given good advice.

bagpussbear

You said things have been rocky for quite a while, and she is angry and negative, and things descend into chaos.

This would suggest she is extremely resentful about something. And it's not been properly brought to the surface, discussed and put to sleep.

When did you first notice a change? Did something happen earlier in your relationship? has either of you been unfaithful?

It's a shame she won't consider marriage counselling. When she says you "need to change" has she been specific about what she wants you to change?

Sorry so many questions!

Have you any plans for Valentines? sometimes the stresses of modern life, working, bringing up kiddies takes its toll on the strongest of us. Would it be an idea to get a babysitter for the night, and take her off to somewhere nice and try to romantically connect with her? Tell her you love her lots, and possibly start to open up a conversation?