Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

But there are 134,000 Tory party members who didn't agree to this. Just because the leader may or may not have said something is a mere detail.

Again, the mere detail of David Cameron agreeing that the Scottish Parliament should be permanent, and that 'all options are possible' with a No vote. Seems to have passed you by somewhat.

But don't worry, it didn't pass 1.4 million Scots voters by. Are there really only 134,000 Tory party members in the UK ? And the SNP have 110,000 in Scotland alone. Wow...that's an abysmal figure for the Tories these days. Are you sure ?

The Crown Estates being devolved were in Salmond's victory speech back in 2011. It was one of the very first things he said. We argued about it extensively at the time ( all those seabed licenses, etc etc ). It's no surprise that it was in the Scotland Bill. Nor that the Tories want to hang on to it, or only pretend to devolve it, to keep the money flowing to the UK coffers. It's very lucrative.

And after all the Greek stuff that's been going on over the last few days. I think we can safely say that there's absolutely no chance of an independent Scotland being chucked out of the EU the day after an independence vote.. it seems it there are no quick mechanisms to do so ( as was said at the time ).

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Again, the mere detail of David Cameron agreeing that the Scottish Parliament should be permanent, and that 'all options are possible' with a No vote. Seems to have passed you by somewhat.

But don't worry, it didn't pass 1.4 million Scots voters by. Are there really only 134,000 Tory party members in the UK ? And the SNP have 110,000 in Scotland alone. Wow...that's an abysmal figure for the Tories these days. Are you sure ?

The Crown Estates being devolved were in Salmond's victory speech back in 2011. It was one of the very first things he said. We argued about it extensively at the time ( all those seabed licenses, etc etc ). It's no surprise that it was in the Scotland Bill. Nor that the Tories want to hang on to it, or only pretend to devolve it, to keep the money flowing to the UK coffers. It's very lucrative.

I was being sarcastic.

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

And after all the Greek stuff that's been going on over the last few days. I think we can safely say that there's absolutely no chance of an independent Scotland being chucked out of the EU the day after an independence vote.. it seems it there are no quick mechanisms to do so ( as was said at the time ).

It would indeed be difficult to chuck Scotland out of the EU because it is not a member, any more than is Yorkshire.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

.string. wrote: »

It would indeed be difficult to chuck Scotland out of the EU because it is not a member, any more than is Yorkshire.

Exactly....

elantan

I see Scotland got its backside kicked into touch again last night, wonder how the people will react

The SNP don't seem to be coming up with the goods, they talk a good game but can't seem to actually make the difference required .... Ahhh well atleast we know it's what we ( allegedly) voted to happen

Shakethedisease

elantan wrote: »

I see Scotland got its backside kicked into touch again last night, wonder how the people will react

Badly. I doubt voters will be returning to Labour any time soon. You didn't really think the SNP were going to go down to Westminster and that the Tories and Labour were going to wave everything through they asked for, did you ?

The SNP don't seem to be coming up with the goods, they talk a good game but can't seem to actually make the difference required .... Ahhh well atleast we know it's what we ( allegedly) voted to happen

56 out of 650 MP's. Was always going to be tough going.

Scottish Labour seem to be suffering from collective amnesia. They've forgotten their own radical tradition of John Wheatley, James Maxton, Tom Johnston. Just because Yvette Cooper has ruled out any separate Scottish Labour Party - and even any future coalition arrangement with the SNP - the party in Scotland has lost its voice.
So, yes, there are problems ahead for Nicola Sturgeon, and the frustrated 56. But they are problems of success. And I suspect they can live with them for now.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/trouble-ahead-sure-but-the-snp-can-cope-with-the-problem-of-success.130264983

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

It would indeed be difficult to chuck Scotland out of the EU because it is not a member, any more than is Yorkshire.

It's citizens are members. There is no quick mechanism to strip that away. Unless you can tell me how that can happen the day after an independence vote ? Strip 5 million EU citizens of their EU citizenship overnight... by which method would the EU do so ?

If you don't know then I think it's safe to simply ignore you on this one.

elantan

David Mundel was saying today the vow has been delivered and we need o continue pooling and sharing, yes I know that's a crook of crap, however, many people still believe the MSM an will believe it has been, I know 56 is no match for the rest of the UK so tell me shake what good are they really? They can't deliver any real change for Scotland, I know they want to, I know they are better than the alternative but last night Scotland lost and we better get used to it, cause it's just gonna get worse and quite frankly hell slap it Into us as it's what the majority want

Thrugelmir

Shakethedisease wrote: »

And after all the Greek stuff that's been going on over the last few days. I think we can safely say that there's absolutely no chance of an independent Scotland being chucked out of the EU the day after an independence vote.. it seems it there are no quick mechanisms to do so ( as was said at the time ).

Few days? Greece has been rumbling for years. Put a far left Government in power and look at the outcome. Anti austerity comes at a price. Don't expect others to pay the cost is the message. As in time the electorate of the member states will individually have their say on the final outcome. The EU power broking politicians themselves are walking a fine line.

ohmochraich

Or the 56 SNP MPs could just argue against the weak, wishy washy, watered down Scotland bill, try to pass amendments ( that they know won't be allowed to pass because of the sheer volume of numbers) and allow the Tories, lib Dems and labour MPs to hoist themselves by their own stupidity and wait until they all get shown the door in next years Holyrood elections. I would think that if they increase their vote next year, on top of the 56 MPs the Scottish Public sent to Westminster and are STILL ignored and overruled - there is only one way that will end - collision course!.

No matter what way you vote - the fact that EVEL is being shouted from the rooftops - (when the SNP are the only party NOT to vote on English only matters), while at the same time, a bill which is supposed to be aiming to deliver more powers to the Scottish parliament is having any ability for any benefits to Scotland removed because ALL amendments are being overruled by NON Scottish MPS ( who haven't even had the decency to attend the debate and who just turned up to vote NO without even hearing what the amendments are!) is an utter, utter disgrace and sadly evidence writ large of the contempt in which the Scottish nation is held by Westminster!.
Whether or not it's obvious yet - this 'Union' benefits England more than Scotland and the SNP don't need to do anything to fuel the demand for independence because the unionist parties in Westminster are doing all the hard work for them by being arrogant gits who are showing utter contempt for Scotland!