Racial comments at school - how to handle it

DUTR

JReacher1 wrote: »

The xxxx is obviously an insult. Prefixing an insult with the nationality/race/colour of the person being insulted add that to the insult.

It's racist and offensive.

I realise some people don't see that it is, but these tend to be people who are not insulted with their race/nationality/colour.

As an example you often see people using the insult "you black xxxxx". I think it's very rare you see people using the insult "you white xxxxx".

Therefore calling some a xxxx is offensive. Calling someone a black xxxx is racist and offensive.

Help me here, I can see 5 x, never been that good at crosswords, if you mean the C word then all 3 creeds I have seen used against them.

eskimo26

I was in a white suburban school too. My nickname in secondary was Trevor [the indian/pakistani guy in fireman sam?] because I 'looked like him'. :T

Wasn't a bully though it came from my own circle so more of a venemous joke that was taken up as a light hearted nickname. Still it shows people's mentalities.

I would report it to the school on the understanding they watch the situation for now.

If you don't report it and it escalates the school will treat the escalation as a first incident and be very lenient which will make your child feel worse.

Also get him into a decent self defense class in case it gets physical, it will teach respect as well as self defense and is good for his fitness and confidence. Secondary can be rough if you get picked up as a target.

EDIT: Hang on a second i just googled trevor and he has grey hair and looks more like a black man not a 14 year old asian boy. Weird people. P:

trinidadone

This needs to be reported to the schools. Have a word with the class teacher, racist incidents are unacceptable and should never be seen to be tolerated. Racist indecents are often recorded seperately by schools. the victim should be well supported, and comforted he is not to blame. The foul mouth other child is to blame. there are a number of strategies the school can also do:

confront the child
general disscussion with the entire class/school on valuing difference
explanation, certain ways of behaving is unacceptable.

If this behaviour is ignored, it sends a number of messages:

victim - its ok to be called racial names, as noithing will be done

other child - its ok to call racist names, as there is no consequances.

the child knows its wrong, it needs to be addressed quickly and swiftly by the school.

Football_Geek

The school won't do anything in practice. Suggest your son tells this bully to stop using racist language, whatever was used.


I don't expect your son will get an apology for what has happened so far. If you want that, then report it to the school and say that is what you want. I suggest your son talks to the bully because the bully is presumably in the same age group and it does not need to be your battle at this stage. I talk from experience.


I remember as a child(one of daily incidents), a boy(3 years older than me) shouted a load of racist abuse at my father and I ran down the street after him. He was the one who was actually scared of me and when I confronted the boy, he broke down into tears. My point is that these racist bullies are cowards.


I would suggest you ask your son to make his friends aware of what happened so someone else knows what is going on. If it escalates, then speak to this bully and tell him you will report it to the police. That will scare the hell out of him.

TheEquilibrium

I am the OP.

Thanks for all your replies. I am grateful have received so many supportive and constructive answers. Some follow my own thinking and some gave me cause to reconsider my own ideas. I hope this thread can help others who read it in the future.

I want to reply in detail as this kind of 'brain dump' helps me.

Some background because there have been some assumptions made (mostly sensible) and I want to just add or reiterate a few things.

1 I didn't and haven't yet used the words racist, racism or bullying. I wasn't sure they applied and I think they can ramp up the emotion.

2 Is my son Indian? You tell me. Some people have fallen into the trap of thinking this is the case. It illustrates how pernicious what goes on can be and how our need to label people can be really difficult. For what it's worth (and it may not be relevant) my son has grandparents born in India a mother born in England. His upbringing has been firmly white middle class British. If you walked into class and asked for the 'Indian Boy' neither he nor his friends would think you were speaking of him (skin tone descriptions illustrate how silly this all is but he probably looks more Southern European). What was said was in effect 'you aren't one of us'.

3 The actual words in the ***** don't matter. The word isn't nice, is sexual in nature and I won't repeat it here. In truth if it was milder or stronger it would change nothing and a debate about whether word A is acceptable and word B isn't, is academic. The words were calculated to upset and offend. I agree that if it was Fat xxxxx, or Gay xxxxx it would be no better

4 Son is very bright (which may be part of why this is happening), knows his own mind seems to be handling it OK. He doesn't want a fuss made. He loves school, is doing well, and seems to have many friends.

So the options you have suggested are:

Tell Parents
There could be sense in this however we don't know the parents too well and when I have tried this before I have found that mummy-goggles get in the way.

Have a quiet word with the school
I need further help on this one from those who suggest it. Schools today and this one (OFSTED outstanding) particularly are very process driven. I think if this is reported to them they would rightly expect all the details, rightly involve all participants in an enquiry, and document everything to cover their backs in case of future trouble. I would do the same if I was them. A molehill becomes a mountain very quickly! But you guys may know differently and suggest a way of flagging it up without causing waves.

Have a serious word with the School
I would consider this. And if I do I will be calm and measured and insistent and pursue it until the problem is solved. As it happens I can be very assertive, and I have friends who know how education works I also vaguely know a couple of the school governors who I meet socially. This of course may not be the pretty way to resolve it but would work. I think it is a good school who do care, and would take action.

Kick the kid where it hurts.
This works, I now it works, as a kid I did this. Even a metaphorical kick by fighting back verbally can work but my son is not that kind of kid he's actually much nicer and more mature than I was at his age - this just isn't him.

Meritaten

"I don't think its 'small beer'"

It is small beer, but you are right it needs to be taken seriously. I didn't want to blow this up on a day when 9 French people were killed in the name of religion

TBecket100
"invite the White kid round to sample Indian hospitality"

I first thought inviting the kid round was mad. I am a nice person, I married someone of a different ethnic origin and I'm a bit of a woolly liberal but I'm not that nice! Also we live 10 miles away from a city with 2,500,000 non-white residents and more curry houses than chip shops so there are better places to try indian hospitality than our house

But if it was done right it could work. I don't think I could make it work.

Itsanne SusanCS Trinnidadone

"Assuming it's the same in England as in Scotland, any racial incident, including name-calling, in schools is treated very seriously. It should be dealt with in a way which doesn't lead to escalation, but I can understand the Indian parent's concerns. The trouble with that, though, is that it is not acting which allows bullying to persist and it's easier to deal with the problem before it becomes a more serious (in terms of the impact on your son) one. It's difficult when your son doesn't want you to say anything, but I think you need to let the school know (though you can do that quietly)."

I have a real affinity to your argument. Yes I do feel I have a wider moral responsibility even if my child is ok to stamp on this kind of thing for the sake of society. The Niemoller quote is particularly telling. If I was advising others I would perhaps say the same, and if it was me who would suffer the consequences of standing up to this I would like to think I would do so. But it is my precious son who stands to lose out. Somehow this makes it different for me.

Fivetide - DUTR-Toniq Geerex- Purple shoes Suzie Sue

"If your son isn't that bothered, has a good group of friends and thinks this is fuss over nothing then, if you trust his judgement, I would be tempted to go with it initially. Keep an eye though and maybe get a copy of the school's bullying policy to talk over with him in case it progresses.."

"The kids at that age are still in the curiosity stage of someone looking different to what they see as the norm, many will soon want to be his friend when they see he is performing top of the class, at the end of the day though, he is taking an early lesson, that not everyone is going to like another in life."

I agree with your approach which I interpret as light touch be guided by child and keep an eye on it.

Lulu92 Lilly Rose
I was so glad that you posted and am quite affected by what you said. I hope that as they say 'what didn't kill you made you stronger'. You bring home to me of the consequences of not getting this sorted out.

Justme111
A bit blunt but lots I agree with. As above bullying for weight or appearance is no less serious. I do as it happens know that this is beyond one bickering remark and raises the question of when it becomes bullying. My school guidelines are very good on this and the key things here are repetition over time and the intention to hurt, both of which are going on in my sons case. A single incident, or a quarrel isn't in the same league.

"Why does invoking nationality make insult worse"
. I think Lulu92 and you had a really good and productive exchange over this and I couldn't better it.

Cavework
I do believe the kid doing the name calling knows it is wrong. He won't be doing it in front of teachers! I don't think he is testing authority he knows where the line is drawn he just doesn't care if it helps him gain power over someone.


Janepig
"Would it be okay if the school nurse for instance walked into his classroom and asked the teacher "I'm looking for James, which one is he" and the teacher said "he's the Indian boy over there"?"

While I personally would avoid this for the same reason I wouldn't identify someone as an elderly lady or an obese man (that it picks one characteristic which while relevant to me may be offensive to the person or is anyway subjective) it could be ok depending on context. The case here is if the nurse said "The Indian xxxxx over there" it would be unthinkable.

Footballgeek
I think you are right about empowering son to stand up to this.


So what we are going to do is leave it a few days and have another chat with son. Say This is something that needs to be addressed and it needs to be stopped. It is serious. Try to empower him. He is the strong one because he is coping with it well and maturely. If he wants it to stop he has the power because by asking me to step in or him telling the school the Name Caller will be in huge trouble and will be punished by the school and if there is any further retaliation the punishment will be worse. He can talk to Name Caller and tell him this - but he must mean it if and go through with it if he threatens to report it.

Also stress that as the adult there are some lines that must not be crossed. If there is anything more than name calling, if others join in, or if it is still going on by parents evening in March (or some other date) then we adults will have to intervene on his behalf. We will keep an eye on it and will keep asking him to report back to us and expect him to keep us informed. If we find out by other sources that he isn't doing this, then again we will have to intervene.

Wish us luck as I am still in two minds!

Thanks again. There are some of you who sound so nice and thoughtful and on my wavelength that I would love to have you round for a coffee and a chat. We could really put the world to rights!

georgie262

Sorry not read the whole thread but the school will have to report anything that is considered racist separately to their bullying figures to the LEA. They do in our local authority anyway and I assume it is the same nation wide

Janepig

I did ask my Indian colleague today what she thought of this situation and her response made me more confused but was an interesting insight into her culture. We agreed though that the scenario I gave about the school nurse having "the Indian boy" pointed out to her wasn't ideal and hopefully the teacher would call him over or something like that.

Incidentally, if this boy who used the abusive term towards the OP's son tries the same thing in afew years time in public then he could be prosecuted for a racially aggravated offence. Use of the person's race before the "insult", ie Indian *****, English ***** (I'm in Wales), Black ***** ramps things up in terms of seriousness, whether we think it's "descriptive" or not.

I had another interesting unrelated discussion with some other colleagues today, one of whom had overheard her year 6 son and his friends calling someone a "downy" - that was a new term on me, to the point that she had to explain that it was in reference to downs syndrome (I'm not always quick on the uptake ) although they didn't use it towards someone with downs, just as a term of abuse about someone. Her son has a classmate with downs and when she sat her son and his friends down to explain why what they'd said was wholly inappropriate and related it to the classmate, they were really embarrassed and hadn't thought of it in relation to their friend.

Jx

meritaten

Equilibrium - you cannot guage incidents like this in relation to other events - especially horrific ones like in Paris.
Bullying (which it is) can become a personal tragedy if it isn't nipped in the bud - and you have a perfect opportunity here to nip THIS in the bud! I suggested a quiet word with the class teacher rather than make a formal complaint at this stage - because sometimes a sensible teacher will take steps with their class in a way which doesn't bounce back to the child involved. If not and this escalates you can take the issue further.

if you don't want to take action right now - at least you are aware of this and can be prepared if matters worsen.

TheEquilibrium

Thanks Meritaten.

we are taking this very seriously and our knowledge of our child, and of the support mechanisms he has at his disposal together with his willingness to talk this through with us in a mature way makes us think a period of calm where we can help equip son with some strategies which will help him now and in the future is worth trying.

I can't tell you how close a call this is and how much part of me wants to intervene and get someone else (the school) to sort it out for us. Even now my gut feeling is that at some point this may become necessary.

A major factor in this is my feeling that 'a quiet word' just like the policemans clip round the ear is an anachronism. At primary school maybe, but at senior school maybe not. Teachers on this site have said that there are procedures which kick in as soon as this kind of thing is reported and the school code on bullying which I have read has a very clear procedure on how staff respond. All incidents are recorded in a log, all are referred to a head teacher, parents of all pupils are informed, records of discussions will be minuted.

I actually think that the school policy is sensible and realistic and if needs be I will be happy for this to happen, but it will be far from the quiet word which you and I might wish for.

Unless someone out there knows different........

Alex121

OP I've read this discussion with interest. The points that jump out at me are that your son reported this to you and he wants the name calling to stop.

It's a different context but in my job role over the years I've had a number of disclosures of abuse (sexual/physical/neglect) from children. Almost always with the disclaimer that they don't want any fuss, don't take it further, don't tell anyone.

But in the end I can never promise them that it won't escalate. In order to safeguard I have to act on the information. It's not uncommon for children to be worried about the consequences of bringing things to light.

In your position I would intervene and inform the school of what is happening. Empowering your son is great but from the way this reads, I think this needs to be brought to their attention.