EE/Orange/T-Mobile - Reclaim ALL price rises AND cancel contract re T&C change

diamonds

ulaggy wrote: »

Chill dude, no need to get tetchy! We've all been nice and civil thus far and we'd like to keep it that way!

I don't appreciate a public employee committing a criminal act no more than someone saying ignore that criminal act and the advice given to hold that criminal accountable. I wasn't being rude, I was being factual...clarify your position or stop talking nonsense.


Cant clarify a MP and police complaint/s of criminal conduct reporting being EXPENSIVE. Because its FREE!

RandomCurve

diamonds wrote: »

I don't appreciate a public employee committing a criminal act no more than someone saying ignore that criminal act and the advice given to hold that criminal accountable. I wasn't being rude, I was being factual...clarify your position or stop talking nonsense.


Cant clarify a MP and police complaint/s of criminal conduct reporting being EXPENSIVE. Because its FREE!

I have found the below:


http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/institutional_affairs/decisionmaking_process/l14527_en.htm

which seems to support what you are saying.


So the question is what have you done to date to get this rectified, and what help do you need?
Maybe you could start (or maybe you have started) a separate thread on effective ways to challenge Ofcom.

g6jns_2

diamonds wrote: »

I don't appreciate a public employee committing a criminal act no more than someone saying ignore that criminal act and the advice given to hold that criminal accountable. I wasn't being rude, I was being factual...clarify your position or stop talking nonsense.


Cant clarify a MP and police complaint/s of criminal conduct reporting being EXPENSIVE. Because its FREE!

You should be doing the clarifying. Please specify exactly what steps you would take to go about the actions you suggest. Sadly AFAIK it is not as easy or free as you suggest. I am happy to be proved wrong.

Mikmonken

RandomCurve wrote: »

I have found the below:


http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/institutional_affairs/decisionmaking_process/l14527_en.htm

which seems to support what you are saying.


So the question is what have you done to date to get this rectified, and what help do you need?
Maybe you could start (or maybe you have started) a separate thread on effective ways to challenge Ofcom.

Agree this forum was set up with a specific purpose and whilst I agree this could be another track it's diluting the crux of what we're trying to do and may make the thread more confusing to those just wanting to cancel via CISAS.

diamonds

RandomCurve wrote: »

I have found the below:


http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/institutional_affairs/decisionmaking_process/l14527_en.htm

which seems to support what you are saying.


So the question is what have you done to date to get this rectified, and what help do you need?
Maybe you could start (or maybe you have started) a separate thread on effective ways to challenge Ofcom.

I couldn't find that half asleep last night, thanks RC.


I challenged Ofcom, and they threw it out that EE were following their guidelines from Jan so nothing was wrong..even when I previously quoted the 2002 EU Directive. Awaiting a MP appointment who will confer with police to attend meeting.


Reported it to City of London and MET as Ofcom chief exec office is there...they wont help me as I'm not a London resident - what that has to do with criminal activity I have no idea. I shall be making complaints against both forces.


That much so far


We all need to report this criminal act en masse, they (police) are already trying to bury my complaints of criminal conduct.

diamonds

g6jns wrote: »

You should be doing the clarifying. Please specify exactly what steps you would take to go about the actions you suggest. Sadly AFAIK it is not as easy or free as you suggest. I am happy to be proved wrong.

Get your MP and police to take complaints of Ofcom CE failing to implement the EU Directive (its in this thread) from 2002 that allows automatic cancellation on any price or term changes in minimum contract period with a EU telecom provider.

diamonds

Mikmonken wrote: »

Agree this forum was set up with a specific purpose and whilst I agree this could be another track it's diluting the crux of what we're trying to do and may make the thread more confusing to those just wanting to cancel via CISAS.

We all need to report this, the last 12 years we have all suffered loss financially by Ofcom refusing to enforce the EU Directive - that's a criminal offence. If we stand up to one and have them charged ALL the regulators* you will see will take notice.




*Self regulation works - my a$$




Can as many people do this as possible, your MP must sign a complaint against Ofcom Chief Exec Graham Howell to send to the ombudsman.org.uk for criminal conduct. You can self report with the police yourselves or ask them to come to your MP meeting.

Mikmonken

just trying to find some more info for the case and found this in the CISAS annual report, while in a different context and we know it already the bit in bold mint be useful in terms of a quote. extract taken from page 17

Evidence for customer agreeing to new contract
The customer complained that despite having a 24-month 3G contract it was terminated
by the company and a new 4G contract with a different brand of the company commenced
without his agreement. The company maintained that on a balance of probabilities it was
highly unlikely that the customer would have been transferred to a different brand without
his knowledge.

The Adjudicator found that as a general principle, if a company wishes to
change a contract with a customer it should seek the agreement of the
customer beforehand, fully explaining the implications and the difference
between the original contract and the proposed new contract’s terms and
conditions. To verify such an agreement the company would be expected
to retain specific and detailed notes, a voice recording or transcript of the
conversation and sale of the new service to the customer. In the event that
the agreement is challenged and where there is no recording or transcript
and the notes are brief or non-specific then a witness statement of the
company’s representative who made the sale should be provided to confirm
that all relevant requirements and good practice have been followed. In
this case the company provided insufficient evidence to clearly establish
that it fulfilled its duty of care to the customer in changing the contract.
Consequently, the customer was still subject to the terms of his original
contract. The company was directed to return the customer to his old contract
and recalculate all charges as if no transfer had taken place. It was a matter
for the company if it wished to re-start the process of seeking the customer’s
consent to begin a new contract following all relevant good practice.

this in from the CISAS 2013 annual report,

Is it possible to use this as precedent within CISAS, or will the adjudicators still make their own minds up, as clearly in our cases there was absolutely no explanation toy what the differences were between the old and new T&C's

OriolaW

Well I guess that's it for me then

Thank you for your response. I apologise I did not cover the change in our Terms and Conditions in my previous email.

Whilst your comments are fully acknowledged, when you entered your current agreement, our Terms and Conditions at this time allowed us to change them during the minimum term of that agreement. They also laid down under what conditions a customer would be able to leave their agreement without penalty.

Under General Condition GC9.6 a customer has the right to cancel their contract without paying a cancellation charge but only where the change is likely to be to the customer's material detriment. The notice we have issued to our customers is not a notice whereby the change is of material detriment, as such there is no entitlement for customers to cancel their contract without charge.

As a company EE does not accept there has been any material detriment due to the recent proposed change in its terms and conditions. Under these circumstances any request from its customers to be released from contract without penalty will be declined. Any customer wishing to cancel their contract may do so by providing the relevant 30 days notice period required but they will be held liable for any early termination fee.

Given the above, as you are in commitment until 10 October 2014. Should you still wish to cancel your contract, you would be liable for the remainder of the minimum term's charges. If you are happy to pay the Early Termination charge, please do not hesitate to contact me on 0800 079 0032 between 8.00am and 8.00pm Monday to Friday.

The company, EE, have fully complied with the General Conditions set out under Ofcom regulations and as the previous emails and this one sets out fully the final position EE has taken, no further discussion will be entered into with regard to this matter.


Yours sincerely

ulaggy

OriolaW wrote: »

Well I guess that's it for me then

It's not over, don't give up yet. RC will no doubt be able to point you in the right direction!