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Civil enforcement ltd claim form N1 help please

2

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  • Dee140157Dee140157 Forumite
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    Ok, you may feel a little upset by the words that people use, however, the advice is good. It is frustrating to give advice of how to find information to help yourself and then get the repeated refrain "but I still don't know what to do"

    To some extent I don't entirely blame you, as this seems to be the way the education system has gone for the last 20 years, where information to pass exams has been spoon-fed, and as a result the ability to research, follow advice and put together ideas is a dying skill. I suspect many of the posters who offer advice come from an older generation, who like myself did not grow up with google and had to learn how to do this.

    Do not cut your nose off to spite your face.

    You are being urged to complain to the CEO as lots of people have had this sorted that way. If you at least try and write the letter of complaint for yourself and post a reasonable draft here if unsure, someone will give you good criticism to help improve it.

    Going to another forum will probably only elicit a similar vein of replies and frustrate you even further.

    So my advice is, swallow your frustration and pride, accept that you need to try and do this yourself and when you put in the effort you will get lots of help.

    No one on the forum want you to pay a vast sum of money to a scammer. That is why they are here. But remember some of the listers may be on here for several hour every evening, and give their time for nothing. People like Coupon-Mad and others have helped hundreds of people with their appeals. They do not deserve to be vilified like this.
    Newbie thread: go to the top of this page and find these words: Main site > MoneySavingExpert.com Forums > Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking. Click on words Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking. Newbie thread is the first post. Blue New Thread button is just above it to left.
  • Hot_BringHot_Bring Forumite
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    lauram25 wrote: »
    Thank you. Will research and gain help from a different forum as to be honest after waking up to reading all the replies I feel less like people helping and more like people just jumping down my throat for saying the wrong thing.
    Hopefully other posters won't be so dumb eh ? Or maybe have a thicker skin.

    Obviously that is your choice. The point I was making is that you shouldn't expect someone to write the letter for you ( although Coupon Mad has spent hours of her own time to create the templates for PPC appeals and POPLA ).

    Draft your own letter to the Co-op and post it here for constructive help. If you're unwilling to do that then it seems unreasonable that you expect someone else to do it for you.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis." - Dante Alighieri
  • edited 1 July 2014 at 12:14PM
    Dee140157Dee140157 Forumite
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    edited 1 July 2014 at 12:14PM
    Copied from other thread
    Am i right in thinking these are my steps
    1 - send in or email over the acknowledge of service
    2 - complain to co op head office as ive heard they are writing some penalties off
    3 - prepare a defence and send it in within 14days - in my defence am i purely stating that the charge is not justified and not admit to being the driver - i dont actually own the car anymore.
    4 - wait.

    all help is greatly appreciated

    1.Yes and say you will be defending.
    2.Yes
    3. Yes and No
    4.No

    I have to go out at the moment but I will try to expand later or someone else will.
    Newbie thread: go to the top of this page and find these words: Main site > MoneySavingExpert.com Forums > Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking. Click on words Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking. Newbie thread is the first post. Blue New Thread button is just above it to left.
  • ColliesCarerColliesCarer Forumite
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    Hi Lauram,

    I know there is a lot to take in and it can be very confusing at first - it takes time to get to grips with it and sitting down with a cuppa, a pad and a pen as you read post #5 of the NEWBIES thread a few times is the best way to start to get your head around all of this.

    Do yourself two lists - take things one step at a time
    List 1) Tasks for dealing with the claim
    List 2) Complaining to the Co-op

    Start to put tasks down on List 1 and to help you get started I would suggest you put
    1a) read Bargepole's guide to Small Claims & PPC's - it's the first link in post #5 of the NEWBIES thread but I've linked it here for you

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=61084955#post61084955

    1b) acknowledge the claim saying you will defend in full (this gives you 28 days (not 14) to submit your defence)
    1c) buy Pranksters guide (costs less than a cup of coffee ) and download the free accompanying guide also
    1d) read Pranksters guide and rest of post #5 NEWBIES
    1e) begin to prepare my skeleton defence
    1f) ....etc etc.

    Once you've done 1b) then think about doing your complaint - the reason I suggest doing it in this order is you don't want to miss your 14 day deadline to get your acknowledgement in - but once you have - you will have a bit of breathing space to do your complaint letter. Once your letter is done and sent off then go back to the tasks on list 1 starting at 1c.

    List 2 Complaining to the Co-op
    2a) follow the links given to research what others have done when complaining and use the Search The Forum for Co-Op CEL to find examples. This is a link to Successful Complaints with Co-Op examples

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4766249

    2b) draft your complaint letter - post it up on the forum for advice fine tuning
    2c) Send in complaint to Co-Op
  • edited 1 July 2014 at 1:21PM
    Coupon-madCoupon-mad
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    edited 1 July 2014 at 1:21PM
    lauram25 wrote: »
    Thank you. Will research and gain help from a different forum as to be honest after waking up to reading all the replies I feel less like people helping and more like people just jumping down my throat for saying the wrong thing.
    Hopefully other posters won't be so dumb eh ? Or maybe have a thicker skin.
    So glad you are back - sorry I was harsh, it read as though you'd paid them already despite the advice you'd already got telling you that the Co-op pay these off and we've seen loads of them! We want you to get this cancelled by the Co-op (or paid by them) and loads of other threads have their complaint letters on them. Search the forum for 'Coop' and you will find other threads about this and how they got theirs stopped. No-one has been to court except Miss McCafferty and she won first time round then won again when CEL tried to appeal the case in February. This makes defence pretty solid as the McCafferty case is relevant. CEL have dropped EVERY other case except those where victims have just paid of course which is...not a good plan...

    As well as searching the forum for 'Coop' as a keyword (no need even for the hyphen). Also put the word 'coop' (no hyphen or it won't work on pepipoo) into the bottom left search box on 'pepipoo forum' and you will find even more cases showing the complaints and advice people used to overcome this. Pepipoo have covered this umpteen times and no-one has paid:

    http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=60 (search box bottom left, put in 'coop' and read the results)

    Also read post #5 of the newbies thread here, it's why I wrote that section, all about court claims and what to do when, etc. Plus links to cases won such as the McCafferty case which you should cite in your defence if you have to go that far. A defence has to be in within 28 days of service of the papers so you have the whole of July to get the Co-op to step in.

    I would just email the angriest email you can muster - how dare they let an agent sue their customers?!
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • lauram25lauram25 Forumite
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    I have read the newbies section n clicked on relevant links - the issue before wasn't that I didn't want to do it but I was looking for a guidance area as when I first looked at it its a lot to digest and even more so for a novice in this area. I wasn't being lazy just I often need a basic guide and then I'm fine - I can just get very confused by many threads and links and of course a lot of threads are related to their personal experiences and not mine etc hense why I started my own thread.
    Whilst I appreciate you guys have heard my story up teen times and get annoyed when someone like me cannot work it out, you guys have to appreciate that I got annoyed as my friends wouldn't be so rude to me so I wasn't likely to be happy about a stranger doing it was I?
    Anyway water under the bridge now - I've sent off my acknowledged slip thing and stated I intend to dispute in full.
    I've emailed a complaint to Co op - was a general address as could not find anything higher up as the few I did find and send to got refused and sent back to me/bounced back.
    I have found a template for the defence from a link that was on the newbie section and all I've added in is my witness statement which it said to do - I took this to mean to explain my reason for being there ?

    Thanks x
  • RedxRedx Forumite
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    excellent, you seem to be getting your act together now (yes its complicated and daunting)

    here is pranksters blog http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/have-you-received-court-claim-from.html

    I have also put some similar threads in here http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5006869 in post #6 too (search word BARNET)

    hopefully the co-op will help you as well

    frankly, I am surprised that a big company like them cannot fight this using their own lawyers on behalf of affected customers like you !

    believe me when I say this, everybody who has replied wants you to win this and for CEL to lose, no question about it (blunt advice or not)
  • lauram25lauram25 Forumite
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    Thank you will let you know if coop reply.


    Redx wrote: »
    excellent, you seem to be getting your act together now (yes its complicated and daunting)

    here is pranksters blog http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/have-you-received-court-claim-from.html

    I have also put some similar threads in here http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5006869 in post #6 too (search word BARNET)

    hopefully the co-op will help you as well

    frankly, I am surprised that a big company like them cannot fight this using their own lawyers on behalf of affected customers like you !

    believe me when I say this, everybody who has replied wants you to win this and for CEL to lose, no question about it (blunt advice or not)
  • lauram25lauram25 Forumite
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    ok so I have drafted my letter of defence, i got most of it from a forum which was from a link posted on the newbie section so am hoping its right, there was a mention of a witness statement, so i took this to mean that they wanted an account of that day - this was nearly 2 years ago so its not clear but ive given it a go - let me know please if i have put too much into that section (i think maybe i have done so)

    Claim number – ****
    On the material date, I was a bona fide customer of Co Op car park in Chingford London E4.
    My defence statement is as follows – The car with registration number ****** was parked in the Co Op car park in Chingford E4 on the date specified and the driver was a customer in the Co Op store for the entirety of the stay in the car park. There was approx. £35 spent in the Co Op store on that day and the queue for a till lasted for 25 minutes as there was only 2 cashiers serving and it was a busy afternoon at the weekend. The camera has clearly not picked up the fact that there was a young child with the driver – the driver actually returned to the car park before the 1 hour time limit but unfortunately had to deal with a toilet incident involving the child which resulted in the overstay.
    No letters or notification from the Claimant regarding the alleged overstay was received, until the N1 Claim Form arrived in the post on the above date. The alleged overstay is, therefore, a matter between the retailers, the landowner, and the Claimant.
    I would also assert that I am not liable to the Claimant for the sum claimed, or any amount at all, for the following reasons:
    1. The Claimant’s notices do not create any contractual relationship between the Claimant and motorists using the car park.
    2. The Claimant has suffered no actual or genuine pre-estimate of loss as a result of the alleged overstay, and their charge of £130 is therefore not recoverable.
    I would also request that the Court makes an order directing the parties to resolve the dispute through the Parking on Private Land Appeals service (POPLA), the independent Alternative Dispute Resolution facility for the private parking industry. This will reduce the burden on the County Courts, and avoid the need for court staff and Judges to deal with the excessive volume of largely irrelevant documents known to be furnished by this Claimant in other cases of this nature.
    I would like to point out that I have emailed the Co Op head office directly instructing them to remove the penalty notice and to instruct CEL to withdraw the claim form against myself.
  • lauram25lauram25 Forumite
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    any feedback on my defense please?

    thanks in advance
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