identity fraud - Natwest acc in my name - NW does not want to know!

grumbler

antrobus wrote: »

The OP has already stated that "phones4u said it had been paid for via a NatWest account set up in my name" and that "I do not bank at NatWest", so obviously the NatWest account isn't theirs.

If the fraudster opened an account on the OP's name, then from the bank's point of view the account is the OP's as it's registered on the OP's name. In this case the bank just needs to make extra efforts to verify the identity of the caller (possibly direct them to a branch) instead of fobbing them off just because the caller doesn't know/remember the account number. At least the caller can be given an address or a telephone number where they can submit all details for the internal investigation.

I agree that it is possible that the fraudster just used the OP's name and some random sort code and account number for setting the DD.

Archi_Bald

grumbler wrote: »

From the bank's point of view the account is theirs as it's registered on the OP's name.

What proof do you have for this?

From the information posted today, I think it is far from clear whose bank account the fraudsters gave to Phones4U to give to Orange. And I think there is a good chance that the account isn't in the OP's name - but we need to wait to hear further.

For the scam to work, the fraudsters just need one "good" bank account in the name of Joe Bloggs or whoever. Or may be any old sort code/account number combination works if Phones4U/Orange don't check the account on the spot.

As we all know (well, some of us do, anyway), the account holder name does not get checked when setting up a DD.

grumbler

Yes, I edited my post (before seeing yours) - it is a possibility.

stclair

I suspect the account is not in the OPs name and was just a NatWest account used to set up the DD.

GingerFurball_2

grumbler wrote: »

Well, the procedure is wrong then if in such case like this the victim gets fobbed out.

The fraudster (if he managed to open an account on the OP's name) is the only party that benefits from this stupidity as after he spends the money the bank is left with unrecoverable debt and the victim is left with trashed credit files that will take a lot of time and efforts to clean.

Only because of the peculiarities of this particular case.

You can look up anyone's postcode provided you know their address, and finding out their surname really wouldn't be terribly hard. Knowing someone's surname and postcode proves absolutely nothing when it comes to identifying someone which is why the bank shouldn't divulge account information to someone who can only identify themselves that way.

It just so happens that in this case it makes things slightly more difficult for the fraud victim, but if someone had fraudulently opened an account in my name, I'd be getting straight onto the police. NatWest are entirely correct in not divulging account details to the OP, as frustrating as that might be.

usignuolo

Just in been out for evening. OK I did tell the police and they gave me a crime number but said otherwise they are not interested as I have not personally lost anything, at this stage.

I have looked again at the PfU paperwork included with the phone and found out some more information. It is not called a contract but a Transfer Note and the values (of the phone, plan and headphones) are all shown as 0.00. Can any PfU customers explain that?

The Orange paper work (called a Customer Information Form) has my name and address and dob on it but nothing else, nothing in the usual spaces where you would expect to see things, like proof of address seen, proofs of signature seen, how long have you lived at this address, time with present employer, all left blank. So are the signature fields.

The bottom half of the form is an instruction to pay a direct debit and this has preprinted an orange dealer code number, stockist authorisation code and service user code with my name -I have no idea if these are genuine. There is also a bank sort code and account number and a prefilled box with a rather garbled address for the Nat West Bank in Chatham (Never been there in my life.) I gave this information to the Nat West Fraud team who said the branch sort code was genuine but the account number not recognised.

Amazing that they can scam an expensive phone with an unlimited plan and a fancy set of headphones, on so little information.Makes you think the phone companies and Orange do very few actual checks. Maybe when they do your credit check in the shop it is not actually checking anything just a pretence....NatWest fraud team were going to get back to me by phone or text. That was nearly 6 hours ago and I have not heard from them.

Still not clear how this scam works regarding the phone plan.

antrobus

grumbler wrote: »

If the fraudster opened an account on the OP's name, then from the bank's point of view the account is the OP's as it's registered on the OP's name....

They did. They asked the OP to supply the "full bank details", which of course they were unable to do. Because it isn't their account.

Archi_Bald wrote: »

...From the information posted today, I think it is far from clear whose bank account the fraudsters gave to Phones4U to give to Orange. ....

Well quite.

The one thing we can be certain of is that the NatWest account is not the OP's account, because they do not bank at NatWest.

stclair

Chatham means the service centre the sort code is linked to.

Is does not mean the account was opened in Chatham.

I doubt the bank will liase with you if the account is not actually registered to your name and address.

You'll more than likely just get a generic response!

usignuolo

Well the branch sort code listed on the Orange paperwork is the correct one for NatWest Chatham. And it shows the plan has been charged to this account registered in my name and address. This has been confirmed in phone calls to Phones4U and Orange themselves. (I have never had a NatWest account.)

NatWest Fraud staff, when I spoke to them however, although confirming the branch sort code was valid , seemed uncertain if the account code, given as mine, was a valid one. They thought if might be a NatWest overseas account. They went away to find out and promised to call or textback, that was around 5pm this evening and I have not heard anymore.

If the account code is invalid, how would Phones4u and Orange be able to charge to it? How did it get past their checks in the first place?

ERICS_MUM

stclair wrote: »

I suspect the account is not in the OPs name and was just a NatWest account used to set up the DD.

exactly. The OP's name and address have been fraudulently obtained so that the parcel could be delivered and then "collected" by the fraudsters.

When I buy on-line I'm often asked if the delivery address is the same as my statement address and the same might be possible when buying items/services buy phone.