Apologizing makes everything forgivable?

Richard53

catkins wrote: »

If you are talking about affairs though then no amount of apologising will ever make it right.

That's true. But let's say you had an affair, made a bad mistake, regretted it and wanted to make things right with your partner. Where do you start? A sincere apology seems like a good place. I know an apology won't make things right on its own, but it's hard to see how you can make things right without one. Unless you are saying that a relationship can never be healed after an affair, which I don't think is true.

unholyangel wrote: »

Personally I think whether people are forgiven should depend on whether they're sorry they said it/did it, or sorry they said/did it and got found out/offended people?

If its the latter, they're not really sorry for the act, they're sorry for the reaction it received and that doesn't deserve any forgiveness in my book.

If I hear "I'm sorry that my actions/words offended you", I translate it as "I regret causing you offence, but I don't regret what I said or did". I think that's a reasonable position to hold.

Example: somebody says something on Twitter, somebody else complains that they are 'offended', the police investigate, and the twitterer is forced into a humiliating apology, David Cameron says it is wholly unacceptable, the lawyers sharpen their pencils, and we are one step nearer a society where no-one dares say a word out of place.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHMoDt3nSHs, starts 3:25.

lostinrates

Richard53 wrote: »

If I hear "I'm sorry that my actions/words offended you", I translate it as "I regret causing you offence, but I don't regret what I said or did". I think that's a reasonable position to hold..

Absolutely.

In some contexts this is appropriate.

E.g. I sometimes hold strong. opinions that I am genuinely sad cause people to feel bad but I feel entitled to hold them, I don't expect them to agree with me, but I don't feel that I deed to agree with them. I can however feel sorry that my position causes them discomfort/pain/sadness.


Otoh, a repeated 'I'm sorry you feel that way' in a domestic situation when trying to problem solve can be maddening, an evasion of responsibility and sometimes look pretty near emotional abuse.


I think my position on this is differing depending on context and situation. I really do believe an apology is an important thing, even when its a genuine expressions of sorrow for hurt caused that you cannot be won over and that you have to agree to disagree.

System

You can forgive but not forget..... and neither should you.

catkins

Richard53 wrote: »

That's true. But let's say you had an affair, made a bad mistake, regretted it and wanted to make things right with your partner. Where do you start? A sincere apology seems like a good place. I know an apology won't make things right on its own, but it's hard to see how you can make things right without one. Unless you are saying that a relationship can never be healed after an affair, which I don't think is true.

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Well for a start I would never have an affair and I someone does have an affair for me, personally, no amount of apologising would make the slightest bit of difference.


I don't think my marriage could carry on if OH had an affair but that is just my view. To me infidelity is so very wrong that an apology would just seem pathetic. I don't regard infidelity as "making a mistake" - no one makes you sleep with someone else

ska_lover

I haven't read the whole thread, but I know what you mean Op

People tend to use the word 'sorry' at inappropriate times too.

If I am standing in someones way in a shop or something, I think the words 'excuse me' to give me a chance to move out the way, are far better than people just barging past roughly and then saying 'sorry' as they are doing it. Saying sorry whilst actually doing the thing you are apologising for, makes no sense to me

Richard53

catkins wrote: »

Well for a start I would never have an affair and I someone does have an affair for me, personally, no amount of apologising would make the slightest bit of difference.


I don't think my marriage could carry on if OH had an affair but that is just my view. To me infidelity is so very wrong that an apology would just seem pathetic. I don't regard infidelity as "making a mistake" - no one makes you sleep with someone else

I admire your integrity, and your certainty that you would never stray. But by saying the above, you are suggesting that, for you, an affair could never be forgiven. That may be true for you, but for many people it is possible to build a relationship back up after a lot of work. No-one is suggesting that an apology would make things right, but it's the first and necessary step in rebuilding something, if the couple feel that is possible.

Of course no-one makes you sleep with someone else, but people aren't perfect and can be tempted into doing foolish things. Even the Church recognises that we all fall below the highest standards occasionally, and has mechanisms in place for redemption, if the 'sinner' is sincere and wants to work his or her way back to true forgiveness.

(I'm not religious, by the way, but that's my understanding of how it works, and I think it is very wise and humane.)

catkins

Richard53 wrote: »

I admire your integrity, and your certainty that you would never stray. But by saying the above, you are suggesting that, for you, an affair could never be forgiven. That may be true for you, but for many people it is possible to build a relationship back up after a lot of work. No-one is suggesting that an apology would make things right, but it's the first and necessary step in rebuilding something, if the couple feel that is possible.

Of course no-one makes you sleep with someone else, but people aren't perfect and can be tempted into doing foolish things. Even the Church recognises that we all fall below the highest standards occasionally, and has mechanisms in place for redemption, if the 'sinner' is sincere and wants to work his or her way back to true forgiveness.

(I'm not religious, by the way, but that's my understanding of how it works, and I think it is very wise and humane.)

I did say that it is only my (and my OH's fortunately) opinion that our marriage would not survive infidelity. Other people manage to rebuild their relationship but I wouldn't be able to.


I don't see that it is difficult to be sure that you will never stray. If you believe it is totally wrong and your love and RESPECT your partner then you can be 100% sure you will not stray. I cannot stress enough how wrong I think infidelity is


Of course people are not perfect. We all make mistakes, myself included but as I said, I don't regard infidelity as a mistake. You make the decision to go somewhere with someone else, to take your clothes off, to have sex with them. I don't know anyone who magically ended up naked in bed with someone.


If my OH were unfaithful (I know he hasn't been and won't be) and he tried to apologise I would just be even more angry and upset. No amount of apologising would make the slightest bit of difference so to me there would just be no point to even try

ska_lover

catkins wrote: »

I did say that it is only my (and my OH's fortunately) opinion that our marriage would not survive infidelity. Other people manage to rebuild their relationship but I wouldn't be able to.


I don't see that it is difficult to be sure that you will never stray. If you believe it is totally wrong and your love and RESPECT your partner then you can be 100% sure you will not stray. I cannot stress enough how wrong I think infidelity is


Of course people are not perfect. We all make mistakes, myself included but as I said, I don't regard infidelity as a mistake. You make the decision to go somewhere with someone else, to take your clothes off, to have sex with them. I don't know anyone who magically ended up naked in bed with someone.


If my OH were unfaithful (I know he hasn't been and won't be) and he tried to apologise I would just be even more angry and upset. No amount of apologising would make the slightest bit of difference so to me there would just be no point to even try

I totally agree with you on this.

There is no way I would be willing to attempt to rebuild a relationship should my husband be unfaithful. What would be the point, would be forever worrying and wondering when it will happen again.

I think the person who gets cheated ON pays a far higher price than the cheater..it must destroy their mental health/confidence..no it just wouldn't do for me, under any circumstances at all

He would be completely unrecognisable and atotal stranger to me. People need to share their lives with a partner with the same values, and if that isn't happening, then there really is no future in it.

I don't think it is difficult to know that you will never stray either, some people talk about sex like humans are animals and unable to control what we are doing..its a cop out if you ask me