Leaving HL without transfer charges

masonic

SnowMan wrote: »

http://www.investorschronicle.co.uk/2014/01/31/comment/smart-money/how-to-complain-about-hargreaves-high-exit-fees-8JX3RKmFayZJfkjUOQgZrM/article.html

Quite honestly I don't understand why HL have adopted this position. Setting aside all legal and fairness arguments, surely this type of negative media coverage is going to be very costly to their brand image. Then there are the costs of administering all the complaints. I would think it would be cheaper for them to just do the right thing and give those 20% of customers who are worse off a free exit (the majority of whom I'm sure will stay)... or perhaps they don't want to set a precedent for when they introduce dealing charges on funds, or remove the £45 cap on fees for holding shares etc.

lejog2003

This is not meant as a defence of HL by any means, but I do think there are some unreasonable expectations here:

1) If you want HL to follow their formal complaints process, then you must initiate the process formally as they specify and ensure it reaches the right person. It really is pointless just emailing them and expecting the snowed under temps in their call centre to know what to do. As I said earlier write to the Senior Client Services Manager and put Complaint or better Formal Complaint as the heading.

2) Expecting a rapid response from HL is unlikely (unless someone near the top caves in). They have to find someone of suitable experience who wasn't involved in the decision to investigate the claim and if the decisions are to be reversed (they don't say this, I know from personal experience) someone with the guts to tell a senior manager/executive they're wrong.

Hence the more people making formal complaints the better.

naedanger

lejog2003 wrote: »

1) If you want HL to follow their formal complaints process, then you must initiate the process formally as they specify and ensure it reaches the right person. It really is pointless just emailing them and expecting the snowed under temps in their call centre to know what to do. As I said earlier write to the Senior Client Services Manager and put Complaint or better Formal Complaint as the heading.

Normally I would agree. However the problem is HL are not well publicising their complaints handling process. People cannot follow a process they do not know about. If HL want people to follow their complaints process they should alert people to it. (Put a clear link to it prominently on their website.) However even people who are complaining are not always being told about it. If those people then complain direct to FOS it is HL's fault.

Hence the more people making formal complaints the better.

Completely agree.

lejog2003

masonic wrote: »

Quite honestly I don't understand why HL have adopted this position. Setting aside all legal and fairness arguments, surely this type of negative media coverage is going to be very costly to their brand image. Then there are the costs of administering all the complaints. I would think it would be cheaper for them to just do the right thing and give those 20% of customers who are worse off a free exit (the majority of whom I'm sure will stay)... or perhaps they don't want to set a precedent for when they introduce dealing charges on funds, or remove the £45 cap on fees for holding shares etc.

I think the poster who called them arrogant before got it spot on, to me they show all the signs of a company that have been too successful for their own good and frankly have become very poor at working out how their customers see them.

There was an article in the press a year ago comparing their bloated organization compared with Cavendish (apparently 5 people working in a small office in Exeter).

Allowing free exit to people transferring would have cost them peanuts. I'm sure they'll retain most of their profitable customers.

lejog2003

naedanger wrote: »

Normally I would agree. However the problem is HL are not well publicising their complaints handling process. People cannot follow a process they do not know about.

Instead of looking for links try typing in complaints in the search field on any page on their site (with autofill I only had to type comp) or even "HL complaints" in Google. Given the leading role of marketing departments in designing web sites, I think you are rather optimistic in expecting such features as complaints or close account to be prominently linked on any website, not just HL's.

JohnRo

lejog2003 wrote: »

There was an article in the press a year ago comparing their bloated organization compared with Cavendish (apparently 5 people working in a small office in Exeter).

To be fair, Cavendish don't need many people because they're piggy backing on someone else's business resources and substantial infrastructure.

naedanger

lejog2003 wrote: »

Instead of looking for links try typing in complaints in the search field on any page on their site (with autofill I only had to type comp) or even "HL complaints" in Google. Given the leading role of marketing departments in designing web sites, I think you are rather optimistic in expecting such features as complaints or close account to be prominently linked on any website, not just HL's.

I agree it can it can be found if you know where to search. My point was it is not necessarily easy to find. And I don't think it is reasonable to expect customers to follow a process if they don't know about it. Furthermore, and more significantly, I believe some customers who complain are not having their complaints treated as complaints. (In my view HL's staff should know how to handle complaints properly better than customers. And I don't believe relying on their staff's inexperience or lack of training is a defence.)

Given the leading role of marketing departments in designing web sites, I think you are rather optimistic in expecting such features as complaints or close account to be prominently linked on any website, not just HL's.

I thought I would check (very unscientifically) this myself. I looked up three other fund platforms and only one of them has details of how to make a complaint on their contact us page. Then I looked at three banks and three insurance companies - all of them did have details on their contact us webpage. So I don't think it is too optimistic to expect to find details of how to complain on a company's "contact us" webpage. However I accept that it is not universal, especially for fund platforms.

I agree that complaints should be made in the proper manner. Where we may disagree slightly is that I hope that FOS will recognise that some complaints may not follow the proper manner because of HL's failings (rather than the customers). In those cases I would hope that FOS makes allowances.

RebTech

masonic wrote: »

...those 20% of customers who are worse off...

I'm afraid I've been paying little attention to what I'm being charged and what I'm likely to be charged for holding funds through HL (ISA&SIPP). Is there a simple rule of thumb to tell whether I'm likely to fall within that 20%?

masonic

RebTech wrote: »

I'm afraid I've been paying little attention to what I'm being charged and what I'm likely to be charged for holding funds through HL (ISA&SIPP). Is there a simple rule of thumb to tell whether I'm likely to fall within that 20%?

If most of your holdings are index tracker funds, or you are invested in both shares + investment trusts you'll almost certainly be worse off than before. Even if you aren't paying more under the new fees, you are likely to be able to find a provider who charges less. It then comes down to the question of whether the savings are substantial enough to justify switching, or if escaping the planned increases in exit fees (particularly for SIPPs) might be important.

gterr

I am just about to post off my second letter to HL, using all the useful info shared on this thread, and asking HL for their final response.


My husband and I have separate accounts with HL but are in near identical situations, so there'll be near identical letters going in from each of us (and to the FOS if that becomes necessary).


HL have only sent one of us the Complaints Handling Procedure notice, and only one FREEPOST envelope to reply to them. Ideally I'd like to send our letters under separate cover, rather than squashed into the same envelope. Can I copy the FREEPOST address onto another envelope, or would it be better to treat one of our complaint letters to a stamp?