The extremely dreaded Atos Assessment

NYM

sniggings wrote: »

no it's not, as long as one of the party know the recording is taking place, if that were the case all these tories that get caught taking payments for lobbing etc would never make it to the papers.

we are talking voice recordings here, no law on them, as said as long as one of the party know about it, video may be a different matter but as said the papers seems to use them without fear of being sued for making a secret recoding or being jailed, so I even doubt it's a problem filming it secrectly if you wished.

' as long as one of the party know the recording is taking place..' ??? sorry, don't understand that point. Which party, the one taking the recording or the one that hasn't given their permission?

Investigative reporters have to prove that publication of any covert recording/video has a 'public interest' element...otherwise, they are breaking the law if they disclose any secretly recorded conversation to a third party.

btw...did you mean lobbying... ?

NYM

Poppie68 wrote: »

Mine was text book...13 weeks on assesment rate, paperwork recieved to inform me i had been put straight into the SG without a medical next payment was correct SG amount.
It's a shame people don't come on here with their positive experiences to let new claimants now it's not always a nightmare. I know before i recieved my desicion i felt dread after reading all the negative experiences.

Totally agree with your point. x

sniggings

NYM wrote: »

' as long as one of the party know the recording is taking place..' ??? sorry, don't understand that point. Which party, the one taking the recording or the one that hasn't given their permission?

you do not need permission to use a voice recorder, as long as one party knows it's being recorded, that party can be the one doing the recording, no one needs to be asked for permission.

You are confusing the regulations on what papers can print with law.

http://www.hsj.co.uk/resource-centre/best-practice/secret-audio-recordings-know-the-law/1332221.article#.UuAPFrTFLIU


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/gordon-brown/6539368/Gordon-Brown-apology-recording-call-breaches-trust-but-does-not-break-law.html

and as for the lobbying typo...grow up.

NYM

It is not illegal for individuals to tape conversations provided the recording is for their own use.

Recording or monitoring is only prohibited where some of the contents of the communication are made available to a third party. If a person intends to make the conversation available, they must get the consent of the person being recorded.

sniggings

NYM wrote: »

It is not illegal for individuals to tape conversations provided the recording is for their own use.

Recording or monitoring is only prohibited where some of the contents of the communication are made available to a third party. If a person intends to make the conversation available, they must get the consent of the person being recorded.

they can put the recording to any use they want...fact is you can recorder anyone you want if one party is aware of the recording.

I could record a meeting with atos and post on youtube, nothing illegal about that.

anyway, I have made my point, up to those reading this if they wish to record or not.

sunnyone

sniggings wrote: »

again that is not the case with all claimants, you just have to look on here and in the papers.

Very sick and disabled people failing the assessment and then winning on appeal.

My husband is very ill and he is also in the support group for the maximum three years, he did not have a assessment because he had the evidence to go alongside his ESA50 like I did.

I have also helped others with their claims and everyone got the ESA award that they deserve, the key to being awarded ESA is to have the medical evidence to back up your claim.

I am pickey with who I aid, I wouldnt help a fripple to claim, only genuine people.

People who have genuine claims need not worry about claiming ESA, their will always be mistakes with so many people claiming this benefit which is why we have the appeals system but it is crumbeling under the strain of the fakers who are on the ESA roundabout, fail the assessment, fail the appeal and reclaim ESA the same day just to repeat the cycle to avoid claiming JSA.

We have had people on here who have failed four or five assessments and follow up appeals yet they still keep trying to get past the assessment stage of ESA, these people are delaying the the claims of genuine claimants and something more must be done to stop this happening.

Just reviewing a claim before allowing a appeal wont stop these people, many know they will never get a ESA award unless by a fluke they get a lazy doc who just want to rifle throught the assessments to get on with his normal life.

sniggings

sunnyone wrote: »

My husband is very ill and he is also in the support group for the maximum three years, he did not have a assessment because he had the evidence to go alongside his ESA50 like I did.

I have also helped others with their claims and everyone got the ESA award that they deserve, the key to being awarded ESA is to have the medical evidence to back up your claim.

I am pickey with who I aid, I wouldnt help a fripple to claim, only genuine people.

People who have genuine claims need not worry about claiming ESA, their will always be mistakes with so many people claiming this benefit which is why we have the appeals system but it is crumbeling under the strain of the fakers who are on the ESA roundabout, fail the assessment, fail the appeal and reclaim ESA the same day just to repeat the cycle to avoid claiming JSA.

We have had people on here who have failed four or five assessments and follow up appeals yet they still keep trying to get past the assessment stage of ESA, these people are delaying the the claims of genuine claimants and something more must be done to stop this happening.

Just reviewing a claim before allowing a appeal wont stop these people, many know they will never get a ESA award unless by a fluke they get a lazy doc who just want to rifle throught the assessments to get on with his normal life.

so the 40% that win on appeal were "just mistakes" all the cases we read of on here and in the papers about who a woman dieing is sanctioned/fails the tests and a blind man has to get help from his MP is "just a mistake...

Look I agree some people will go through the process fine, I have not said other wise, but when so many have to appeal to win their case, it's clear something more is going on here than mistakes.

Glad you and the people you help are fine but it's not that way for everyone...and you should not have to provide evidence as you say to back up a claim, the assessments are meant to be able to judge whether someone passes or not, my guess is, those with a load of doctors reports etc atos dare not lie about those cases as it would be very easy to make them look foolish.

For you to be near enough saying that there is not problems with atos is laughable considering the reports over the last 5+ years.

I think the OP has now got a clear idea, that some have good outcomes and others have a much harder fight on there hands.

seven-day-weekend

JasonBat wrote: »

Thanks sniggings ol' chap.

They sound very sneaky indeed and it sounds like they are scrutinising you before you even enter the 'exam' room.

I'll give them a ring tomorrow and try arrange for some kind of audio recording. Failing that all I have is my mobile/smart phone to record the 'assessment' - probably not the best but I can't afford anything else living on peanuts.

I know this will be unpopular, but what's the problem with that?

When my husband had his IB medical, he was in a terrible state with anxiety. Had they have observed him whilst he was waiting for the medical they would have seen him in a terrible state of anxiety. He would not be laughing and joking outside the room but a gibbering wreck once he got inside.

So surely if your condition is genuine it will be genuine all the time and that is what they will see, whenever they observe you.

Morglin

They do often observe people, if they can, coming in, and in the waiting room, so they can get a wider picture, but they used to do that under the old ICB system.

Without question, there were massive problems with this whole process until relatively recently, but improvements have been made, to what it was.

ATOS employed too many under qualified HCP's who were trying to say they knew better than consultants - not a good idea.

For many disabilities now, the assessment, paper or medical, HAS to be done by a qualified doctor, which has helped.

I have helped with many claim forms, for other people, as well as my own, and the golden rule is to ask for a report every time you see a consultant, brief your GP and other health professionals about your difficulties, and ask them to provide reports you can send with the form - I always do this, and everyone has been happy to help, and never charged for doing so.

The more coherent and accurate info you can supply with the ESA50, the less chance of problems. If you cannot manage the form alone, then get some help via the CAB, or similar. Attach sheets with extra info, if relevant. Send, in time, and preferably by Special Delivery.

Some, patently, do go wrong and there has been some ludicrous decisions, which needs improvement.

But, there are many more going through with no problems than there were about 2 years ago. ATOS are being audited to check the veracity of the assessment, and their recommendations.

The DWP DM's are having to be much more cautious, in their decision making, to try and cut the backlog of appeals, caused when there was something of a push to make everyone 'fit for work', which was nuts.

But, unpopular as the view might be, I worked for the DWP, during the 80's, when we were instructed to put everyone unemployed we could, onto sickness benefit, which cut the official unemployment numbers, and was politically expedient. :wall:

We had to put people onto it for illnesses etc., that would never have qualified before, few checks were made, and unhappily, a certain mindset has carried on where SOME claimants have very little wrong with them, but feel unable to work.

They obviously need structured support to eventually return to work, which was supposed to be what WRAG was about, although these WP are proving worse than useless anyway, particularly with anyone who has been on ESA.

Labour bought in ESA to try and change this increase of being unable to work, by so many, and the Tories are carrying it on.

But, the problem is that in their haste to get the 'basically fit' off of ESA, they are catching up a lot who are genuinely unable to work, and probably always will be.

Nothing is simple, with benefits, at the moment, but your best chances of a successful claim is to be organised from the off, and send lots of verified information.

Lin

JasonBat

Morglin wrote: »

They do often observe people, if they can, coming in, and in the waiting room, so they can get a wider picture, but they used to do that under the old ICB system.

Nothing is simple, with benefits, at the moment, but your best chances of a successful claim is to be organised from the off, and send lots of verified information.

Observe me only if you are qualified to do so is what I say. Jumping to false conclusions on ignorant observations does no justice to anyone.

It seems that if one sends them organised information they use that against you as 'being able to organise'. I didn't send them a report along with my form and maybe that was a bad move especially as I have plenty of them that we used in Employment Tribunal battles against potential employers because of disability discrimination some time ago.

There's another dubious government system if you ask me. To make matters worse, they are hitting ET claimants hard financially these days as a better service to the 'taxpayer'...

Should I take a report or two with me on the day?