Elderly ex-pat nightmare,,any advice?

mcdunstan

This is our situation and we are are worried sick. My husband's parents moved to Spain about 30 years ago along with my husband's brother.

All their savings have run out and they own one apartment outright..worth £200k if it could sell but others in their block have been on the market for years.

My husband & I have to give them £1500 a week..yes, a week...plus additional large payments, to pay for their care as they need a 24hr carer, to pay for their ridiculously expensive private healthcare insurance, to pay for rent and living expenses on for the brother.

My brother-in-law is schizophrenic and needs to live separately to them. He is stable with medication, is settled and happy, has a girlfriend who keeps him well and he tried living in the UK years ago but couldn't cope. We know Spain is better for him & were planning on him moving into the parents flat when they die so we only have to pay his healthcare & living costs.

My husband's Mum is severely bipolar, needs copious amounts of drugs & medical attention, is incontinent & has bad arthritis. His Father has just recovered from lymphoma & has a heart problem.

We are at breaking point with these costs & with them going up too. It is nearly breaking us financially & we face a real problem with how we can sort this out.

They don't want to move to the UK...they're in their 80s..but if they have to they would have to sell their flat which would be impossible. It wouldn't pay for a property near us as they need 3 bedrooms..one each & one for carer and we live a very expensive area where 3 bedrooms are at least £350k. Rent is approx £1500 a month for 3 beds. It still leaves the problem of his brother & what happens to him...Our house is too small, we rent & we have 2 young children so it's not practical.

Are they entitled to any benefits abroad?? Is his brother?? I doubt it but just wonder. Anyone got any suggestions..we feel so trapped having to pay all this & we could go bankrupt as a result when we've struggled to build a business these past 7 years...

madhatter90

Hopefully someone with better information will come along, but I'm sure that they should be able to make a claim for some contribution based benefits. There's a link here that talks about it:

http://myvicinity.co.uk/index.php/benefits-and-health-care-for-expats-in-spain/pensions-and-benefits

Just didn't want to read and run, since it seems you're struggling. Hope things get better for you. Remember that your health and sanity is important too.

whitewing

I know that morally you should pay/sort it, but I don't really understand legally how you do?

Are you absolutely sure all costs are fully legitimate? Or are some of them nice-to-haves?

Could you go and nurse them for a year or two? (Not that I would be able to do that, but who knows if it were a choice between that and losing everything...)

mcdunstan

Thank you. The link was very helpful. Perhaps they might get disability living allowance from the Spanish gov. I'll look into it. They have the house as an asset but no money so I'm not sure...

With regards the whole scenario, moving to Spain to look after them. Our business is here which we can't give up on yet & we both work in the business..too many staff need it to work too. Plus to complicate it even further I share the care of my mother who has Alzheimer's with my brother & a carer. Fortunately she's 5 minutes from me, gets attendance allowance for a carer & we are trying to keep her out of a care home for as long as we can. Plus we've two kids aged 8 & 6.... Settled in school, plus too noisy to live with older people, 2 large dogs... My mother-in-law's bipolar disorder sadly makes her incredibly difficult to live with so my husband finds it really hard as well as I'm sorry to say her moods and comments just annoy and upset him even though he knows she's ill. It's very tricky keeping her stable as her metabolism is changing as she gets older & drugs need careful monitoring. My advice to anyone is don't move abroad for your old age!!! We moan about the NHS but it's free and compared to other countries, it's amazing. In Spain if you are in a state hospital & you can't speak fluent Spanish they make you pay for an interpreter & it's expensive. The care wouldn't be good enough for her very tricky & ever increasing needs anyway. We'll survive! Just trying to think of ways to make the business create more money! And buying lots of lottery tickets! Thank you so much for your time xx

seven-day-weekend

Anyone who is of pensionable age should get free healthcare in the State system in Spain. Ask the British DWP for a Form S1, this will cover them to be treated the same as Spanish Citizens, (i.e free). They then have to register this with the INSS (Social Security) in Spain and will receive a Spanish Health Card. If they can't do this themselves then maybe the son's girlfriend can help out or they can then employ a Gestor (para-legal) to do it for them.
.

FBaby

Something doesn't sound right. If they've been there for 30 years, they are as much as residents there as any other spaniards. Did they move there and not work? Never paid taxes? You say they have private insurance, surely that means that THEY should be paying out now rather than you still paying it?

Either they have failed badly to secure their retirement avoiding paying taxes when they should have, or they are not claiming what they are entitled to. Regardless, they must be entitled to some walfare support by the Spanish government, same with your brother.

It sounds to me like your husband needs to make a trip there and get into all the paperwork and understanding of the Spanish system.

wildwestfan

do they receive any payments like Retirement pension from the UK?

I believe if they do they can apply for Attendance Allowance even though they live in Spain.

MissMoneypenny

I don't understand why they are paying for their own medical cover. Under EU laws, once they have been exercising their EU rights in another EU country for 5 years, then they automatically have PR in Spain and can get Spanish citizenship a year after that.

Therefore, as they have been self sufficient and supporting the Spanish economy for 30 years, Spain should be paying for their healthcare; just as we pay for the healthcare of Spanish citizens living in the UK

Ask on this forum
http://britishexpats.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=75

They will be able to tell you what benefits they can recieve from Spain too, but I doubt it will be much (if anything) as Spanish citizens seem to prefer to move to other EU countries if they want benefits.

mcdunstan

They would be entitled to free medical cover over there, you're right. I think because of the nature of their illnesses my f-in-law has always had BUPA because it's quite difficult when the staff don't speak English. My m-in-law's bipolar is really bad. I will look into it again though. My f-in-law has just buried his head in the sand with everything. We couldn't just leave them high and dry so we took over paying for everything...that was when business was great. Different times now. They're 85 and 81 but I think we're going to have to move them back over here...I'm so annoyed with my f-in-law for not buying a flat for my husband's brother when he could & for not thinking more of the future...

Caz3121

mcdunstan wrote: »

I think because of the nature of their illnesses my f-in-law has always had BUPA because it's quite difficult when the staff don't speak English.

After 30 years are they not able to get by in Spanish?

mcdunstan

Talked to husband..Healthcare in Spain- the family members are expected to do the nursing type care of patients & it's strictly medical attention given. His Dad couldn't do that. His brother couldn't do that. His brother's Spanish girlfriend would to that & is enjoying having everything given to her for free..( but at least she keeps his brother stable, makes sure he washes & shaves etc.) BUPA gives a lot more obviously & English speaking etc. They are entitled to free medication but it has to be "signed off" by some guy & he refuses so my f-in-law pays 10 euros each time he collects the prescriptions... I don't think you can get carers allowance in Spain unless you lived a certain time in UK in the last year. But I suppose strictly speaking the care they have is just to keep my f-in-law sane because overnight m-in-law calls out for attention constantly, or gets up & falls over so we have a carer there so he can sleep as he is quite weak in himself. It's a hard one.
If the brother could live in their flat so we dont have to pay his rent just give him money to live, & the parents move over here, would they be entitled to care allowance & housing benefit here?? The flat wont sell..I know it won't.
We've looked into equity release but for some reason it's not possible plus we want the flat for the brother to live in. He's been over there 20 years or so too..never worked because just can't cope.
If the flat was put over to us ( we've basically paid for it anyway) we could then let his brother live in it rent free. He is always going to e. dependant & always has been from aged 18 when diagnosed. Parents come to UK. They have about £3k in the bank. Could they get an old people's flat near us on housing benefit??