school fines for out of term holidays?

duchy

Person_one wrote: »

Well yeah, there are loads of ways these parents could enrich their kid's lives in the UK in the school holidays, but as you point out yourself, they don't and/or won't.

What they might do is go on a cheap week in the sun because they want to, and the child benefits by accident. I can't begrudge them that.

For parents who do care and are just not very well off, they can make that 'chav' week in Spain very enriching and educational.

Except those parents who do care would be more likely to go to Devon or one of the other holiday areas where they aren't exposing their kids to a "chav week"

Oh and they have palm trees in Devon too ....as you think they are important )

pollypenny

duchy wrote: »

You rather missed the point - the kids were still off for a day middle of term -even though there was no need for them to be as the teachers had done the training outside of school time ......so it was just an excuse for teachers to have a day off -and the kids had a disrupted week...which is never good educationally. It appears this school and their LEA operate to a bit of a double standard not wanting parents to disrupt education-but do it themselves when it suits.

No, you missed the point. The training days are extra days in the year for teachers. This does not mean that they were added on to the end of any term.

For me, the most important day was before February half-term, when we standardised marking of coursework samples.

Person_one

duchy wrote: »

Except those parents who do care would be more likely to go to Devon or one of the other holiday areas where they aren't exposing their kids to a "chav week"

Some 'chav' parents live their children. Shocking, I know.

Nicki

I came from a family who couldn't have afforded a holiday abroad whether in term time or holiday time. The first time I went abroad was when I was 18 with my now husband. My way out of that background was by getting a decent education. Although I went to a rubbish school as well I did go regularly and was one of only two in my sixth form to get the a levels to go to university. From that background, I would say that a week in the sun during school holidays doing nothing but stay in the resort around the pool would not have benefitted me in the slightest and if I had missed something crucial that week at school could have disadvantaged me more

WestonDave

As a starting point I'd say that we don't take or intend to take our kids out of school in term time unless something exceptional comes up. We did consider it for a 70th birthday celebration trip that would work better out of school holidays but as of now its more likely to be in school holidays - we're only talking a day or two not two weeks abroad.

However, what is clear to me as a parent (can't speak for teachers) is that schooling works best when school and home work together. Creating a situation where the school and family are at loggerheads because of an arbitrary rule risks undermining co-operation. That being the case its not surprising to hear of heads tacitly approving absences where attendance and attainment are otherwise up to standard. Having heads able to use a degree of discretion seemed to be a much better solution.

What is perhaps a question for the powers that be, is that rather than attacking parents for trying to find a solution to expensive summer holidays, is whether we can nationally help to resolve that problem by more radical measures. For example our 6 week summer holiday is a hangover from the days when farming dominated and all hands were needed in the fields for harvest. That is why our holidays correlate with the rest of Europe and add up to massive demand for holidays for 6 weeks, and lower demand for other weeks - with consequent effects on prices. What about if we revamped our school calender so that holiday was better distributed, clashed less with the rest of Europes long holidays and rather than a long summer break we had possibly a more broken up calender so that kids get less tired. Mine came home for Christmas exhausted - maybe a earlier summer break and a 3 part early August to December period with 2 half term breaks could work better. and by reducing the correlation with other countries holidays we'd get better prices as resorts would be in lower season.

Trouble is that will never happen because change is always hard to implement however obvious the benefits.

bestpud

You'll never convince some teachers that anything outside their little bubble is worthwhile. Their existence depends on the majority believing school is essential.

The more enlightened among us know the education system reproduces the class system and underprivileged children are merely contained until they are 16 and they can claim benefits or find a minimum wage job.

You only have to look at posts from teachers to see their attitude toward these families and children quick realise their place in the school pecking order.

It won't do them any harm to step away from that for a week and it may even do them some good.

snookey

More control by the government. Does this apply if your child goes to a fee paying school.
Im fed up to the back teeth of being told what I can and can not do with my own child.
I agree a child needs an education but we parents also need choice.

duchy

pollypenny wrote: »

No, you missed the point. The training days are extra days in the year for teachers. This does not mean that they were added on to any term.

For me, the most important day was before February half-term, when we standardised marking of coursework samples.

That's fine but had you twilighted it -the kids could have had that extra day off when weather was better (you obviously missed the point about a training day midweek disrupting the flow of the academic week) ...or even ...here's a novel idea -twilight ALL training days and NOT disrupt the kids at all -Teachers wouldn't miss those few extra hours working -just like people in industry work late to ensure projects are completed to time. Unpaid overtime is a fact in many professions now -why not teaching - Is there any good reason why "teacher training days" can't become teacher training evenings and only disrupt the teachers and not the parents ? The number of working parents vastly outnumber the number of teachers after all so it would benefit many more than it would penalize.

duchy

snookey wrote: »

More control by the government. Does this apply if your child goes to a fee paying school.
Im fed up to the back teeth of being told what I can and can not do with my own child.
I agree a child needs an education but we parents also need choice.

Yes most private schools have it as a condition in the contract that parents won't remove kids for termtime holidays....however it is less of an issue as private schools generally have longer holidays anyway so parents can dodge the "top rate for holiday time" bullet as they can go (say) end of June rather than July/August only.

And you do have a choice-you could home school ! The law simply says a child must be educated -it doesn't say they must go to school !

bestpud

Nicki wrote: »

I came from a family who couldn't have afforded a holiday abroad whether in term time or holiday time. The first time I went abroad was when I was 18 with my now husband. My way out of that background was by getting a decent education. Although I went to a rubbish school as well I did go regularly and was one of only two in my sixth form to get the a levels to go to university. From that background, I would say that a week in the sun during school holidays doing nothing but stay in the resort around the pool would not have benefitted me in the slightest and if I had missed something crucial that week at school could have disadvantaged me more

As you were clearly self motivated and keen to do well, you could easily have caught up on a lost week.

It's really not as complex as it sounds.

Unless we are talking about years 10 and 11 when children need to be at school so the teachers can coach them through the exams, because only they know how to answer the questions.

That's not education though, it's spoon feeding just enough information to obtain a GCSE.